Anyone could start a charity called “123 Sqn Charity Fund” with aims to promote the aims of the ATC within that unit etc. However it would be up to HQAC if they’d let the trustees of that charity get involved with our activities. It would essentially be just another outside organisation.
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What if your civcom chair doesn’t like those things at the moment?
There’s no real change here.
^ this is a great idea.
Solves the problem with minimal fuss.
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Personally I’d see this as a Good Thing.
Rather than each unit trying to buy and maintain their own, have a pool of vehicles which can be used across the wing.
If you really need them all at the same time… it’s probably because they’re going to the same place(s)?
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I believe (although not an expert being English) that Scottish squadrons CivCom are actually fully registered independent charities under Scottish charity law with Scottish charity numbers which is significantly different to the position in England with Excepted Charities and such. Wonder if that has been considered….
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Has anyone seen anything that even hints that’s money will just go to big wing funds? I think that’s a massive overreaction from those who see an evil plot behind every cloud.
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Civ Com chair is elected by the Squadron Association for a fixed term and on the committee is but one voice.
Who outside of the Civ Com chair elects the Wing Chair… Nobody.
But if units refuse to fundraise money that is not guaranteed to be spent by them how is this fleet being financed?
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Or if a wing is geographically large or my old wing Merseyside 40 miles by road, Southport one end to Northwhich at the other, one hour? on Google Maps journey at this time of the night, which a load of , daytime it’s far longer timewise. How do you position said vehicles for use, who maintains them, who holds the keys?
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Tonys letter.
Supposed conf this weekend.
General chat supporting this notion.
But no, nothing xoncrete.
As always.
I just want to be ahead of the wave, so i can prep my sqn the best.
If that means setting up a seperate charity or spending all our cash, so be it.
But heads up info is key in this shambllic org.
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I feel a blow out coming along if this is true - all civcom’s should just empty the coffers before the transfer.
Our wing bank balance is very healthy. They don’t need to go robbing squadrons.
It’s hard enough getting the bank to add another signatory, so I can’t see this being a quick process. Plus it’s the RAFAC, so that guarantees it won’t be quick!
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How many years has Tony K got left? He’s had what two or three already?
can he get these changes done in the next fours years?
If he gets to his last year or even his last two the political will won’t be there for him to get his reforms through.
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Taking the SOV thing forward. Thought the responsibility for maintaining sits with local Viv Com.
Does this mean Wing Chair will now go around all ‘his’ squadrons to check SOVs maintainable records as per requirements 
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Ahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Ahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Nice one, oh man oh man you guys crack me up sometimes.
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Wing civ com cannot in effect sequester anything as any monies or assets are property of the Squadron Association as administered by the Squadron civ com, any attempt to do so could result in legal action for theft.
The RAFAC could make SOV use so onerous that it is easier to sell it and put the money back into the bank account of the civ com.
If this happens? Would that be the first step to stating all Squadron non public assets AT or canoes or radios etc now belong to a wing pool and they decide when it’s used etc
Surely the same logic is applied to equipment as the money. It belongs to the squadron association so this would still not be possible.
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SOVa belong to the Squadron Association and civ com could rightly tell anybody from outside the CoC who can inspect the records etc on the provision of a map very articulately where to go.
Correct but it would not stop them trying, the non CFAVs in the organisation don’t really know how to function “outside of the wire’. They have been so used to until recently to the ‘because I say so it will happen,’ one Gp Captain proved that when told to act in a way she knew to be unlawful. There are people on here who could give a far better opinion of the legalities than I.
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Yet this is the point i was making with my original post…
They will have a very hard time taking over civ coms in Scotland as they are all independent charities with their own OSCR charity numbers so it would need the approval of the whole civ com to go ahead.
This would be a nightmare for my wing considering we do not have a wing bank account. Currently the wing funds are sitting in several sqn bank accounts.
Could you imagine the extra work for the wing treasurer. This would need several people to handle this especially if they need to do 20 OSCR returns every year, Attend 20 civ com meetings every quarter, handle all the bank transfers and monthly financial reports. Could you imagine the wing treasurer going through the accounts every month to make sure all the cadets had paid subs. This very quickly becomes a full time job for an accountant.
I was told that sqns in Northern Ireland were scrambling to register their sqns as charities with the charity commission to prevent them being forced down this route.
I can see SNI being excluded from this as it would cause to much of a headache as lawyers would end up getting involved and not be cost effective for the organisation to force this.
Practically, it would actually be very straightforward.
Sqn associations (which is the charitable entity) dissolve and transfer all assets to the wing charity.
This is written into the template constitution (ACP 11 Annex A):
- Dissolution of the Association. The Association may be dissolved by:
a. A directive of the Air Cadet Council (ACC) of the Air Training Corps (ATC); or
b. A resolution, approved by the ACC, passed by the Association’s members in general meeting. If the Association is to be dissolved, the Committee will remain in office and be responsible for winding up the affairs of the Association in accordance with this clause and the following:
…
e. The Committee members must apply any remaining property and/or money:
(1) Directly for the Objects
(2) By transfer to another squadron or the wing non-public funds.
…
In essence, if the air cadet council decide to dissolve squadron associations, they can do so.
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