Need some advice


#62

I’ve never been quite able to ascertain what the expected outcome is from all this? Is it a cadet(s) thrown out of the ATC? I will say this and it might not be appreciated, seeking something like that will have the potential to create a whole load of aggro inside and outside the ATC, the latter the ATC can do nothing about.

So there wasn’t an essay or full-blown statement from all concerned written in the camp log, as suggested it would have been little more than a couple of notes to say something happened and it was dealt with.
If it required some degree of medical intervention then there would be more as it could impact participation in other things. Which staff need to know about. Plus potentially ramifications later.

I think also a bit more of a sensible approach would be to say to your child, people say all sorts of things. For their sake you could have spoken to the CI and just asked they keep an eye on things, tell your child what you’ve said and they’d have calmed down.
My brother and I and many of our mates would have been long dead if any of us had carried out “do that again and I’ll kill you”.
If the threat had been attempted that’s a different thing altogether, but it wasn’t and never was going to be, as history shows, given your child is still alive, despite all parties remaining on the camp.


#63

Surely the old occurrence book and the way it has been used in past years cannot be in compliance with current data protection laws.


#64

IANAL, but I would hazard a guess that at long as it doesn’t contain 2 items of personal information, then it should be ok?

“Cdt Bloggs of 123 Sqn misses his mummy” would be OK, but “Cdt Bloggs, DoB 01/01/1900 misses his mummy” would contravene our data protection rules.

Even if it did have 2 items of personal information, would it just not have to be stored in a lockable container to be above board?


#65

I have seen detailed medical information written up with regards to incidents or ailments in previous camps, and these books go back for years.

At the very least, existing books should be retired and filed securely. There is info in these that random other staff simply do not need to know.

If there is actually a need for a book like it (something I remain unconvinced of), there certainly needs to be clearer guidance on what needs to be written. Confidential reports need to be done on separate documents that are treated with care and returned to the wing HQ or CCF along with the other camp admin paperwork.


#66

Don’t CC’s have a full admin pack they complete which is then held at WHQ? I know we all bemoan the amount of admin, but a 1 page incident log template wouldn’t be too much to ask…

Incident involving camp, accom., etc = 1 copy for wing and one for next CC (maybe one for self and one for ACLO). Fill it out once and photocopy as needed.

Incident involving cadets then 1 for wing, 1 for any COs of those involved.

Saves all this daily occurrence book nonsense and loops in those who need to know or may need to reference later. No different to when an accident report is sent to WHQ.


#67

said as if each Tuesday and Thursday a report is written of what occured on those nights on Unit

FS Smith taught map reading to 1st Class
Mrs Jones taught Heartstart to the new recruits
Plt Off Gregory taught principles of flight
CCpl Porter ran Canteen

that doesn’t happen

^that


#68

Maybe it should, can you remember who taught what six months ago if an accusation drops though the letterbox?


#69

Would it really matter?


#70

In what context, an allegation of sexual assault or impropriety arrives, what do you then. remember cases have been brought many years following an assault.


#71

I was just going to day the same thing.

On for AT, DofE and FC, it wouldn’t hurt to have a written record of last know locations for groups and staff members, just in case the weather closes in and the emergency services get called out.

We could even submit it when we close out the SMS activity… :grin:


#72

I highly highly doubt that someone giving us such an allegation that happened on the squadron wouldn’t have the slightest clue who the person was or what they looked like. I would be telling the police who was down on our register and who if any visitors were signed in, SMS has all the staff photos on and i can guarantee you even my newest cadet knows 80%+ of the staff by name.

Different story obviously for off sqn activities, but completely unnecessary to do a diary for on sqn activities.


#73

In which case whether I was teaching Map Reading or Military Aircraft Systems is unlikely to make much difference.


#74

And joint squadron activites with 3 or 4 squadrons locally?


#75

On a squadron night, we will have visitor records, anyone who comes in my building signs in (as should everybody at every squadron). If it was a joint activity it would normally be something that would require JI’s (possibly even SMS applications) which would list who was doing what.


#76

i would
1 - use the training programme to determine who was scheduled for that lesson that night
2 - use the register to determine who was at the unit that night and if the intended instructor was down
3 - speak to others in the class to determine if points 1 and 2 don’t correlate
4 - if first class consider looking in their book against who signed that evenings section off.

if a daily occurrence is added to Squadron duties, then i claim my £5 that Bob is part of the “Admin reduction team” - nice idea but yet to see any reductions


#77

I call it CYA not admin reduction.


#78

Depends on the wing
Our wxo doesn’t give you a thing other than the time of the buses if he has remembered to book them.other than that the CC is on their own and are responsible for supplying everything from there on in.


#79

I’ve never been quite able to ascertain what the expected outcome is from all this? Is it a cadet(s) thrown out of the ATC?

That was never my intention, my intention was to prove the accusations against my children were false

So there wasn’t an essay or full-blown statement from all concerned written in the camp log, as suggested it would have been little more than a couple of notes to say something happened and it was dealt with.

When an incident was reported up the chain of command should there not have been a paper trail??
As I said what if the cadet in question had carried out the threat and attempted to suffocate my child in their sleep?? Would that also not have been recorded??

I think also a bit more of a sensible approach would be to say to your child, people say all sorts of things.

This was done after they were singled out and treated differently on their return to sqn A, AFTER to CO of the sqn only had my 2 in the office and said if anything happened with cadet M my 2 children would be removed - what about cadet M? He obviously had listened to them, why not my children? Why assume it was one sided against cadet M when if fact cadet M was the instigator??

given your child is still alive

So if my child had been suffocated and I ended up at their funeral, would that have been a better time for me to ask for advice??


#80

I would assume that the other cadet had been spoken to by the OC and most likely told the same thing. do you have anything to prove that he didnt sit down with Cadet M?

If i had a cadet move to the sqn who had history like this, i would be telling both parties that i would not accept any incidents between them. Regardless of who was at fault in the first instance. I have seen many times bullied become the bully.

Depends on the incident, the context and more importantly how it was reported and who too. Remember that as staff we are still human and do make mistakes. I have dealt with a few too many “Threats” over the years, one ended up with the police and another was a quiet word of advice, each incident is very different and i may as the man in the big chair deal with it too harshly or too leniently and can only go off what i am told.


#81

If that is the case then the OC should have a record of this conversation; if nothing more than to cover them just in case.