The whole ‘depends on your wing’ for uniformed service etc etc is a nonsense.
For example my original wing at the time didnt allow anyone to go straight into uniform until about 2014/15.
Their ‘rule’ was CI service first and ‘work up’.
Of course now they realise that’s madness, but for those of us caught under that numpties rules it has meant…
No early CFM.
And some no 2012 jubilee medal.
Not that medals are the be all and end all. But when you think we are supposed to be ‘valuing volunteers’ it’s very disappointing.
I did 5 years as a CI so effectively did 19 years of service from 20; the 2 as CWO, 5 as CI and 12 as AWO & Officer before I got my CFM. Did it worry me no and neither should it worry anyone. If getting a medal and additional strips of metal is that important stop and think why we are doing this. I’m not sure I really appreciate recognition from an organisation that couldn’t give a monkey’s if we, unpaid volunteers (PTD etc is not pay), were in it or not. Frankly regardless of whether people are staff as civilians or dressing up, the criteria and item received should be the same for all be that a medal or bit of paper, not one thing for one and something different for others, we all do the same thing … cheap babysitters for teenagers. The cost is irrelevant and insignificant compared the numbers the MoD is quite happy to urinate up the wall each year. In doing this, it would in one foul stroke go a long way to eliminating some of the ‘them and us’ that exists between those adult staff not in uniform and those that decide that they want to be in uniform. I know this wouldn’t happen as they need to make being in a uniform somehow different, to make people do it.
I’ve always loved the notion that the day they start donning a cadet forces uniform it somehow immediately infers people are better, a laughable situation. I know many CIs who are worth more than a room full of uniformed staff, but are effectively regarded as Untermensch by the organisations, because they aren’t, don’t or refuse to go into uniform.
As soon as the cadet forces (and it has to happen from those at the top paid levels), gets it head from up its own backside, we may then develop into the organisation(s) fit for the 21st century it needs to be and not some arcane throwback to the 1940s.
The whole CFM thing only needs one CI to instigate a discrimination case and the house of cards will collapse.
That’s the whole reason that a break in service was extended from being 6 months to 3 years. If you stop being a Cadet at 20 you have theoretically 1 year of Uni left and then 2 years to get your life settled before coming back and retaining the 2 years you have accrued. (It makes no difference if you are a CI or just out of the organisation for those 3 years).
Having stayed in uniform throughout Uni etc I have already qualified for my first clasp at 36. (But I had the advantage of being one of the last 22 year old CWO’s).
That’s a complete load of tripe. Its not about feeling important and contrary to what you may think, some people are happy to contribute without uniform.
There’s more to youth development and mentoring than uniforms, badges and power trips.
Because youth development and mentoring isn’t all about throwing on a uniform and big timing it.
I’ve had my fill of uniform and with my work constraints a CI suits my lifestyle and work commitments.
The CFM has its requirements.
You fit the requirements? You get the award.
You don’t fit the requirements? You don’t get the award.
Are you hard of thought or something?
I have never suggested anything to the contrary.
I’ve been in this organisation for 25 years and have worked with plenty of happy CIs. I don’t require your educational input thanks. Particularly not from someone with such an apparent contempt for those of us in uniform.
I can only assume this used to be a rule or it’s either a FAD or misunderstanding. WhenI was approaching my 12years served many 10-15+ older were convinced I wouldn’t get it as I never reached CWO they all said it which such confidence I can only assume it was once true.
I am one of those sprogs.
Having been a CI for 9 months I was still 30 when I was eligible for my CFM.
@wdimagineer2b I know plenty of my uniformed compatriots who have nothing but contempt for others in uniform, for one reason or another. A number of contributors on here espouse this of their volunteer uniformed counterparts.
Far too much importance is bestowed upon people in uniform, such that it is easy for them to lose sight of what is important and what makes people volunteer. As a result we are stuck in this situation that to be “worthy” of things, you only get them if you wear a uniform. If we lost this notion and accepted that uniform is just a thing and not that important.
I don’t think that the CFM should be limited to those in uniform, all staff should be eligible after the determined time and I’ve never understood how cadet service equates to adult staff service, speaking as a someone who was a CWO to their 22nd birthday.
CFM and PTD for all CFAV won’t happen as they need things make being in uniform different. If people got things just for being adult volunteers of all ilks, why would anyone choose to go into uniform. The things we do, do not really need a uniform it’s only the organisation that would struggle.
simply because you were an adult at the point of your 18th birthday - thus you did four years as an adult until your 22nd birthday.
adult service = time as an adult > this shouldn’t be a complex notion to understand
You are welcome to contribute your time and not wear uniform, but you need to accept that there are things that it is not appropriate for you to do if that is what you choose.
Just because the book says something, that does not mean that it is perfect. If something isn’t perfect we can try to change it. It is odd that you are complaining about the rules for one thing and then saying we shouldn’t suggest changing other rules. Again, it seems like you just can’t stand people disagreeing with you.
I would be amazed if they had the admin procedures available to check for eligibility for CI’s going back pre Bader, after all, we have to make a claim for CFM medals and clasps rather than have them actually awarded by the organisation.
‘oh right, you want a medal to do you, well ok then if we have to, send in the form, with all the dates on and we will process it…’
Maybe Bader will improve it and allow all volunteers to feel valued in due course…………
Best guess in the olden days if you didn’t make it to CWO you stopped being a Cadet at 20. You then weren’t able to become an AWO until 22 although you could go for a Commission straight off. However if your boss didn’t want you as a CWO they would be unlikely to have you as a Plt Off. Also back then you only got a 6 month break of service as standard.
So quite simply if you didn’t make CWO you would be unlikely to meet the criteria due to breaks on service, which then became gospel.
It is an interesting subject as NATO awards it’s highest award MSM to both civilians and uniformed staff and all lot of the civilains are contractors and are treated equally with uniformed staff as it’s based on achievement and merit and not on whom or what you are…
To be fair, by the time you reach 18 as a cadet, you are usually performing similar functions to staff such as teaching on a weekly basis and on weekends. Some 18+ cadets put more work in than certain staff members (we’ve all had those staff that turn up for 1 parade night every 2 months but manage every social function!).
There is nothing whatsoever inappropriate about giving ‘civilian’ staff medals, and anyone who thinks so clearly-misunderstands the traditions and intent within the overall UK & Commonwealth honours and awards system.
ALL Cadet Force Adult Volunteers (including ‘Staff’ Cadets) are required to possess and maintain approximately the same security and safeguarding clearances. ALL are formally-appointed, all have service numbers, all must attend the same initial orientation & fundamental training requirements.
The only difference (significantly) is that there is not a formal minimum attendance expectation from CIs, in comparison with uniformed staff.
However…we all know that a self-solving solution exists for this. And that’s staff attendance records on Bader.
There are CIs that put in masses & masses of vital effort over the years and these individuals are invariably praised/recognised/acknowledged in a number of ways, at Sqn/Wg/Rgn/Corps level: there’s never an argument about who those people are (and you, yes, You, know at least a few).
Therefore: if appointed CIs have met or exceeded the mimum attendance requirement over the current requirement of service years, have an OC Sqn sign-off on the existing formal paper-based systems AND they are willing to accept the medal- I believe they could and should be given it.
This action would not break the bank: it simply applies redress to an ingrained omission, and is fair/just & appropriate…
