A proper BDA will have to come from HUMINT or SIGINT, the US will say they hit what they were aiming for and Iran will claim
It didn’t penetrate.
I wouldn’t bet against the US ability to bust a bunker though.
HUMINT most likely to be from Israeli sources.
As for SIGINT, too early to say - especially with the 
Felon / Kegsbreath adding their interpretation.
Pictures released show 2 x 3 MOP groups at the main nuclear site. Guessing at suitable intervals to maximum the penetration. The WW2 Grand Slam was very impressive but “only” 20,000 lbs & dropped at lower altitudes of course.
1 Like
Yeah, but there are bunkers, and then there are mountains.
3 Likes
Before the strikes, there was talk that it would take multiple bombing runs to actually get into Fordow. Essentially digging down over multiple hits. I think it’s circa 100m deep, with the MOP only able to get through 60m of soil. The Pentagon says they dropped 14 MOPs over 2 sites, so I assume Fordow got hit with at least 8? (assuming 2 per aircraft, so even numbers per site, Fordow being deepest, so 8?)
Absolutely no way to confirm the damage from satellite imagery, as it’s all underground. But given the stats, I certainly wouldn’t have wanted to be in there while it all kicked off!
Without independent people going in, we’re just going to be going off of assumptions and guesses.
I prefer what Russia calls us - “Main b*****ds”.
1 Like
I suppose you still buy a licence as well. Ever been to Israel?
1 Like
Out of curiosity are Israel still part of IACE?
Had a cadet go there many years ago - was an enlightening experience for them.
2 Likes
Yeah, because, a) I know that a TV licence is literally a licence to watch TV. It always has been. It isn’t a licence to watch the BBC. It’s just that the fee is used to fund the BBC.
B) I think the BBC is largely a force for good, so I have no qualms in supporting it. I also use a lot of BBC services, radio, news, weather, iPlayer, so I don’t think it’s fair that I shouldn’t pay for services I use happily.
The best thing about the BBC is that both the left and right hate it because they accuse it of being imbalanced and untruthful, and if both sides think that, then you’re probably hitting balance.
And no, I haven’t been to Israel. I assume, from the repeated question that you’re itching to tell us that you have been, and therefore, have gained, purely by territorial locality, some magical insight that invalidates all negative opinions of the place.
5 Likes
I suppose you’re a GB News type of chap?
I tend to read a spectrum of news as every outlet (the Beeb included) has an agenda. The Telegraph and Guardian can both happily put a completely different spin on the same story with outright lies on both sides (having seen the way they both reported a Supreme Court case I had when in practice there’s no way they made a mistake with the untruths, they must have been deliberate).
The truth is somewhere in the middle and I find more often than not that the Beeb is closer than most, though you shouldn’t take everything they say without questioning it. I agree with @Baldrick that both the left and right accusing them of being biased against them is a good indication of their actual impartiality.
4 Likes
I’m with you until that last paragraph. The idea that both the left and right accuse the BBC of bias is an oversimplification.
Everyone on the right, including the softest centre-right can plainly see that the BBC has a centre-left, pro-EU, pro-lockdown, ‘globalist’ bias. The only people of the left who complain about the BBC are those to the left of its centre-left position, such as Corbynistas.
1 Like
Yep, very “strong” people. Israel isn’t a nation that I would want to mess with - & Mossad is a definite certainty to avoid!
Digging through this, it is a prime example of the BBC getting the balance correct.
2 Likes
I think (with some minor reservations) that the Beeb do the best they can. Historically, they have always been trusted internationally for reported news & I don’t think that they would want to risk this.
Again, with perhaps some slightly stronger reservations, when I used to travel around the globe & wasn’t able to catch up with BBC news, Al Jazeera was fairly neutral (a bit of "lean left "maybe) but of course, more recently, their favour relating to Israel, Palestine, etc, has changed.
2 Likes
So did anyone else see the comments Putin allegedly made when asked why Russia wasn’t do in by more to help its Ally Iran? He supposedly said “well Israel is basically a Russian speaking country, 2 million Russians and Soviets have moved there and we factor this into our thinking”.
How’s that for an excuse to not have to meet commitments you aren’t able to make.
1 Like
The BBC has greater respect for its impartiality internationally than it does nationally.
1 Like
If I was Israeli I’d be quite concerned about those comments, in light of the justification given for the special military operation invasion in Ukraine.
Putin doesn’t mess with people who could Nuke him.
2 Likes
Yes I have and it would be an education for yourself to go.
1 Like
Nah, I’m really good for giving that place tourism money right now.
Sounds like Al-Udaid might get hit by the Iranians, or at least they’re on high alert. US base, but we’ve got people there too!