He had a seat. B)
Erm… because as you get older your metabolism slows and your circulation deteriorates hence why veterans feel the cold more than young people and ergo can cope with warmer temperatures.
Erm… because as you get older your metabolism slows and your circulation deteriorates hence why veterans feel the cold more than young people and ergo can cope with warmer temperatures.[/quote]
Spot on. There is also a factor that many older people (men especially) such as my dad who is 88, wouldn’t dream of going out sans blazer/jacket and tie, because when they were growing up they dressed like their dads, given there was no ‘teen culture’ such as we have experienced since the 50s. So comparing how the veterans dressed to how the cadets were told to dress is rubbish.
Mind you when I first started work it was jacket, collar and tie regardless of the temperature, unless the Chief Accountant said otherwise. He’d have a pink fit if he saw what people wear today as normal office wear. I still wear a proper shirt and trousers as opposed to some of my colleagues.
Personally I think personal comfort and the comfort of others is the primary consideration. Being anally tied to some rule or other that isn’t going to affect safety or doing the job, is plain stupid and a is behaviour that should be consigned to history. I tend to look at it as does it in enhance what you are doing by having a tie on? Does anyone who sees us day to day really care. Even out in the public gaze no one gives two hoots as GOM says people see essentially smart young people, which, as long as they look smart will always be the response.
Apply the rules too tightly that don’t need to be and you rapidly lose sight of things.
whilst I hear some thoughts on older generations being able to handle the heat I have been involved with the ACO this time round for approx 20yrs and its only in the last year that I have seen this practice happening… discuss
I did it 6 years ago on Cyprus Camp, definitely wasn’t the first time we did it.
Discuss…
I did it 6 years ago on Cyprus Camp, definitely wasn’t the first time we did it.
Discuss…[/quote]
maybe its just people getting photographed then!
I did it 6 years ago on Cyprus Camp, definitely wasn’t the first time we did it.
Discuss…[/quote]
maybe its just people getting photographed then![/quote]
Dangerous thing that. I recently had a lengthy discussion on the subject of a photograph of some cadets wearing the wrong hats. The general tenor of the argument lead me to the conclusion that under the new regime of uniform regulations we can’t have any fun and photograph it. So no more silly camp photos, no more rank raffles pics and no fun. (to be fair, I checked 1358C. Fun isn’t issued)
i wore wedgwood shirts, sans tie, and with sleeves rolled up in about 90/91/92.
comparing the young and the old and their sensitivity to heat is madness - have you not noticed mad old biddies wearing 8 layers of clothing on a boiling hot summers day? 30c and still wearing a duffel coat and hat when everone under the age of sixty is sweating like Gordon Brown in a maths test?
wokkaman is all serious now he’s a RWO and got the T&L’s up. Fun and common sense seem to go out of the window when people get given a crown or coat-of-arms to wear.
wokkaman is all serious now he’s a RWO and got the T&L’s up. Fun and common sense seem to go out of the window when people get given a crown or coat-of-arms to wear.[/quote]
Oh play nice - they have to act all serious now that CACWO has allegedly said that any region WO who doesn’t respond to his emails within three days will be sacked (according to the current rumours anyway…)
wokkaman is all serious now he’s a RWO and got the T&L’s up. Fun and common sense seem to go out of the window when people get given a crown or coat-of-arms to wear.[/quote]
Oh play nice - they have to act all serious now that CACWO has allegedly said that any region WO who doesn’t respond to his emails within three days will be sacked (according to the current rumours anyway…)[/quote]
Is that the same CACWO who (allegedly) said that he was going to crack down on staff at Nijmegen carrying umbrellas as it was against Dress Regs?
[quote=AP1358C]Optional Dress Items
0136. Umbrellas. Personal umbrellas may be carried for use by all personnel whilst in uniform, except when on parade or participating in other ceremonial occasions. They are to be plain handled and black in colour.[/quote]
How else will I remember the password?!
I can see these people having a wobbly if they saw us doing silly drill; mincing, teapot turns, ministry of silly drill steps (homage to Monty Python) and so on.
How many of us have worn and seen berets worn “flat cap” style?
Lighten up if we lose the ability to have a bit of fun then what a sad world it will become.
But then apply rules that don’t compromise safety too rigidly and you lose respect.
Dress regs yes we have to have them, but commonsense has to be the by-word at all times. I don’t think that the people who compile them have any commonsense. Sitting at a desk or taking a lesson of some sort does wearing a tie enhance or make what you do better?
wokkaman is all serious now he’s a RWO and got the T&L’s up. Fun and common sense seem to go out of the window when people get given a crown or coat-of-arms to wear.[/quote]
Gunner I am all for having fun, but I get so many emails in my inbox from ACO staff, RAF and members of the public… what am I meant to say?? “they are just having fun, they are only kids” as for the serious side, nothing has changed since becoming RWO, apart from the emails I get a load into my WWO account too and I have to deal with at Sqn level on my own unit…
wokkaman is all serious now he’s a RWO and got the T&L’s up. Fun and common sense seem to go out of the window when people get given a crown or coat-of-arms to wear.[/quote]
Gunner I am all for having fun, but I get so many emails in my inbox from ACO staff, RAF and members of the public… what am I meant to say?? “they are just having fun, they are only kids” as for the serious side, nothing has changed since becoming RWO, apart from the emails I get a load into my WWO account too and I have to deal with at Sqn level on my own unit…[/quote]
Actually, what’s wrong with that? It seems to me that if the context is acceptable. i.e. not on parade or in public. What is wrong with the response “They are just having fun, they are only kids?”
Compare what some RAF Squadrons do when they do those silly squadron photos where they all parody dress regs in WW2? You know the sort, pith helmets, white scarves suspended by coat hangers, massive buggery handle moustaches, fake dogs etc. Or those mock music videos that you see units do in Afghanistan or Iraq. Who are they to have a go at us?
We are after all a voluntary youth organisation, the kids are supposed to have fun, (heaven forbid so might the staff from time to time), if it isn’t fun they will leave. And nothing is more fun than breaking dress regs, (especially when you know it’s naughty.)
its a youth club.
someone - i’m looking at you m’darlin - needs to get a grip of this utter throbber (phnarr) and read him his tea leaves.
did he get turned down for an Afghan tour for being a moralé hoover and now he’s taking out his frustrations on the one organisation that can’t send him to South Georgia?
wokkaman is all serious now he’s a RWO and got the T&L’s up. Fun and common sense seem to go out of the window when people get given a crown or coat-of-arms to wear.[/quote]
Gunner I am all for having fun, but I get so many emails in my inbox from ACO staff, RAF and members of the public… what am I meant to say?? “they are just having fun, they are only kids” as for the serious side, nothing has changed since becoming RWO, apart from the emails I get a load into my WWO account too and I have to deal with at Sqn level on my own unit…[/quote]
Actually, what’s wrong with that? It seems to me that if the context is acceptable. i.e. not on parade or in public. What is wrong with the response “They are just having fun, they are only kids?”
Compare what some RAF Squadrons do when they do those silly squadron photos where they all parody dress regs in WW2? You know the sort, pith helmets, white scarves suspended by coat hangers, massive buggery handle moustaches, fake dogs etc. Or those mock music videos that you see units do in Afghanistan or Iraq. Who are they to have a go at us?
We are after all a voluntary youth organisation, the kids are supposed to have fun, (heaven forbid so might the staff from time to time), if it isn’t fun they will leave. And nothing is more fun than breaking dress regs, (especially when you know it’s naughty.)[/quote]
Errrr in public is the main problem and by some of the comments people don’t know the rules…
[quote=“wokkaman” post=20433][quote=“Gunner” post=20426][quote=“Baldrick” post=20423]we can’t have any fun and photograph it. So no more silly camp photos, no more rank raffles pics and no fun. (to be fair, I checked 1358C. Fun isn’t issued)[/quote]
wokkaman is all serious now he’s a RWO and got the T&L’s up. Fun and common sense seem to go out of the window when people get given a crown or coat-of-arms to wear.[/quote]
Gunner I am all for having fun, but I get so many emails in my inbox from ACO staff, RAF and members of the public… what am I meant to say?? “they are just having fun, they are only kids” as for the serious side, nothing has changed since becoming RWO, apart from the emails I get a load into my WWO account too and I have to deal with at Sqn level on my own unit…[/quote]
My Bold - what do the ‘disgusted of Tunbridge Wells (armed with an Amazon copy of “Spotters guide to AP1358C” (no doubt))’ say exactly?
I rest my case. I’m sure that you and those of your ilk will continue to tell us and insist on enforcing them no matter what the situation. 
We once had a mancunian WO on my Regiment Sqn who was a 30yr service, real Warrant Officer. He had us in stitches most of the time but he always let us know (if we didn’t already!) when it was appropriate to act seriously.
When I was at Catterick, dress regs were meticulously followed come rain or shine. Thing is here, Air Cadets aren’t Regiment Gunners cutting about the Depot so why can’t those wandering around with crowns on their sleeves, cut them - and staff - a bit of slack on appropriate occasions? Maybe you could educate those members of the public who complain as Baldrick suggests?
Remember, the crown is worn on the sleeve, not around the head.
I hear you and I will always take can for any “ad-hoc” call that I make in the real world of being sensible. Ie if a cadet is freezing cold on ex I would rather they put on a softie of any colour than state you can’t, But people need to stop putting pictures in public view. I echo your “real” warrant officer views, trust me I have played the fool plenty of times but if your stupid enough to get photographed and not keep that for your own collection then don’t expect to hide behind the “situation dictated” to go against the rules… In other words Don’t Get Caught!!
There are some situations where there is a genuine H&S concern which leads to Wedgwoods being worn incorrectly.
There are plenty more where is is seen as an easy option to cry H&S and throw the rules to the wind. A case in point is the decision to wear 2A/2Full at a public event (not a ceremonial occasion) simply because it is thought to look smarter then being “caught out” when the temperature soars and we have to get all scruffy. In many of these situations, the cadets would have been better off in 2C with its flexibility rather than light blue.
What winds me up even more is publishing photos on public pages of people dressed incorrectly when it is within the realms of possibility to tidy them up again beforehand!
