Happened to me when I was an WSO. A certain FS smirked at me (wdimagineer2b knows who it was - his surname sounds like a letter :wink:) and said I had ‘no authority over him as he reported direct to the WWO’.

Apparently, they heard me in Argentina…

If I, as a Regiment NCO, was told to do something by the Adj and then told him I’d have to run it past the SWO first, I would be able to count in nanuseconds, the length of time my head would have remained on my shoulders.

Why do the SNCO Cadre feel they are a breed apart? Who in hell is allowing them to do this? I suspect it emanates from the very person who is charged with setting standards within the Corps and for ensuring everyone abides by the rules. If only they spent as much time sorting out their SNCO’s\WO’s as they do on whining for permission to wear QCS caps, crunchy boots and white belts, the organisation would be a lot better off.


Really? Does the Naval Section have LCpls, Cpls, Sgt etc? I think not!!

Your example doesn’t really cut it either as they only wear two ranks when they are above 1* commanding Joint units. A Captain does not wear 3 stars and then two gold bars!!


That’s not just his assertion, though: it’s explicitly the reason (though I can’t now remember if it’s JSP313 or 814).

The RN has actually just updated its CCF rank structure, which previously topped out at PO (=Sgt). Fine if your senior RN cadet is just in charge of a small section but a bit unreasonable if he/she is the senior cadet in a Contingent of 200+. They now have cadet CPO and WO ranks.

You’re right though, there’s nothing below PO; everything else is a rate (AB, LS roughly = 1st class, Leading cadet). If we didn’t have LCpl/JCpl we would just have to cope but it’s better with it.


Sorry to disappoint, but I wore (in addition to my own) US rank tabs and I was only a Major. It wasn’t out of preference, it was simply that US soldiers seemed to be genetically unable to learn ranks other than their own…


Oh well wrong again​:roll_eyes::roll_eyes:

Just heading off to kill my source of that info!!!


I think this has been coming for a while. It happened when they created their own chain of command, then managed to place members of that chain at the top in several places: CACWO, Corps Training WO, Corps Drill WO. They’re everywhere!

There is no equivalent for officers because we have the actual chain of command, which sucks. While NCOs are able to leapfrog using their own one, which is frankly better.


I know this is off topic so apologies admin!

Are the CACWO, Corps Training WO etc etc actually in the NCO’s chain of command. My boss is my sector commander and my SNCO’s are in my chain of command when on the squadron. Anything being ran off the squadron they take direction from the Activity Commander.

If the CACWO came down and started ordering my SNCO’s around then surely they can tell him with all respect to bog off and speak to myself (within reason)?

Within the same vane, the WO may be the CACWO and work direct with the CAC, but that doesnt mean he outranks a Flt lt.

Im curious about peoples interpretation, its never been an issue ive come across as other than the occasional idiot typically i get on pretty well with all staff in my area.



To some extent they have a separate chain of command because they tell people they have a separate chain of command.

The reality is that they have a separate chain of command because a self-perpetuating group of bullies have burrowed their way into the Corps, and the somewhat lacklustre command of the Corps simply doesn’t have the testicular fortitude to grip them lovingly by the throat.

There is also the reality that, at Sqn level, it’s widely/universally believed that there’s one rule for us, and another for Dawn’s Creatures - and that there is simply no point in attempting to grip these people because you’ll get a bullying snotogram from some GCSE-free stick monkey, with your Wing Commander CC’d in, telling you to back off. Your WCdr will then send you an email advising you to soften your cough, however right you may be, because these are Dawn’s Creatures, and she lets them do what they like.


Couldn’t of put it better!


Im under the impression tate and lyles are incoming for WO with 12 years service as a WO and WWO and above …


That sounds horrifying…but might be like this beards thing. I’ll believe when I see it.


I could tell you a little more…but my username isnt very imagnitive and i would get in a spot bother…


Not opposed to the Tate and Lyles, IMO should get rid of the crown and use the Tate and Lyle’s for WO and being in at least an adult Cpl rank.

But Tate and Lyle for a select few… why…


I believe its all to do with the RAF not being ok with the idea of 28 year olds wearing tate and lyles. In the RAF majority of WOs are nearing 25 years service when they get their promotion. So roughly 40 years old…brings the corps in line with that. (Appointed Sgt at 20, min of 4years to FS, 4 Years to WO promotion stage 1 (28 years old, 12 years of that brings you to 40 abd awarded T&L)

Cpl (RAFAC) i think will become to gap between 18 and 20 if the survey of cadet service is anyrhing to go by…


People in the RAF can attain WO rank as Master aircrew quicker I believe.


Warrants at 40 are a rarity…

That’s interesting with the Cpl idea… don’t understand why you have to start at Sgt. Majority of my training has been taken by Cpls. In terms of Range Qs and, dare I say it, drill quals, I don’t think the Sgt rank conveys any more extra privileges? I mean, I can’t do any of the above because I’m not an NCO. But between a two and three stripe is there much difference?


There is when you go on a station.


Guys. Pace sticks.


Cpls get pace sticks too… (in a DI capacity…)