On the specific issue about our Hon Ambassador’s uniform error, Gp Capt Vorderman has been issued with the correctly branded rank slides but accidentally left them behind for the Aerospace Day but had her RAFAC pins with her. Rather than have her wear no RAFAC identifier and risk being criticised for masquerading as a Regular Officer, we decided to allow her to wear the pins on her rank slides. She was very sorry for her error but we had no spare Gp Capt rank slides available as hers were made bespoke as she is the only RAFAC Gp Capt. I hope fellow volunteers could be a little more forgiving.
I can’t imagine in the real military world there aren’t individual differences/nuances to uniform that get ignored. The problem in the closeted world we seem to have to become, something like this gets blown out of all proportion, because we have developed a group of people who seem to have little else to do with themselves. It is incredible that you get the boss of an organisation putting something out there as it seems there needs to be a justification.
In this instance the boss should be more worried about what the 32000 (or whatever it is now) cadets are not getting and ensuring they will and or can get it, rather than some piffling trifle.
As for youth club, I think we are a youth organisation that tinkers with a military mindset but where the large majority of staff have no military experience makes it more like a club for kids to come along to and some oddball adults some who dress up to help guide them. We are in essence a place for like minded youngsters to come and do things together like a youth club. The youth club that I used to go to, did trips and organised activities, especially during the summer holidays. While not as disciplined in the military sense, they didn’t put up with any crap and kids were banned if they misbehaved in any way. This was separate from anything I did with cadets. I learnt more diverse things through the youth club, that stood me in good stead later on than I did being a cadet.
I’d send you home to get your correct rank slides, that is outrageous behaviour, and will greatly affect your ability to support the deliver of the cadet activity…
It depends how much you take things to heart I suppose?
We don’t work for them so that can’t sack us and if we go, any experienced member of staff who leaves is a loss and not at all easy to fill. But this doesn’t seem to worry them. Which in itself is a worry.
I still think after several conversations with Area WOs, there are people who have too much time and little to actually do. They walk away safe in the knowledge we need to be grown ups and not throw toys around. The last couple of annual staff meetings the WWO gets up with a load of pictures from SM about things that aren’t exactly as book and starts on a rant. I invariably go to toilet as it’s a much better use of my time.
Perhaps you shouldn’t be whining about people who are actually doing the job they have been engaged to do: that of educating people and trying to ensure that all of our personnel are as correct as possible in the areas of drill and dress.
Maybe help them by paying attention and taking that advice to heart, even if you don’t personally care about it?
I think the issue here is not those of the P-SAS* cadre trying to educate others concerning standards of dress but rather those same members who have a coronary when confronted with a uniform that has a stray hair or a loose piece of thread dangling down.
It’s those throbbers who give the rest of their cadre a bad name.
From my time in the ACO\RAFAC\whatever it’s called this week, I’ve found that certain people of a certain non-commissioned rank, get all bent out of shape over the most trivial things when it’s clearly unnecessary.
Certainly far more often than I EVER experienced in the RAF.
Maybe it’s about time the CACWO - and their peers - got a grip of these people and re-educated THEM before they inflict themselves on the rest of us? Only then will people begin to take them seriously.
Surely we are mature enough to take it out on those people specifically causing issues, not tarring everybody with the same brush?
There are too many people who tak3e things far too seriously - something that is not limited to any particular rank or role. They need to be convinced to get a grip on reality, but winding them up is seldom helpful, even if it is slightly cathartic.
No. You lot need to put your own house in order before you start throwing stones at other people’s houses.
Maybe there are but I’ve seen far more SNCO’s acting like they’re Gunnery Sgt Hartmann, than officers taking things too seriously. SNCO’s have been given a role and part of that role is enforcing dress standards. Simply put, they need to be beyond reproach themselves BEFORE giving cadets and\or officers a hard time. To me, this means that the CACWO et al need to make sure this happens.
Engaged implies employed, these are volunteers who seem to have little or no sense of proportion, no ability to look at things objectively or possess any common sense. We’re all the same side for crying out loud yet as @Gunner rightly says more SNCOs in the ATC seem to have less of an ability to accept things than the officers.
As a (former) WO, I was always reasonable with my expectations when it came to uniform, as I knew it would take ages and someone (invariably me) taking a days’ holiday to rectify things. I pointed this out to an area WO who moaned at me about some of the cadets’ uniform, as the jumpers wasn’t the current pattern, not that it was tatty. When I asked can he insist that stores fill our orders every time and can he go and get it when we demand it as you seem to have more of a problem than me, it all went quiet. He then tried it on with the adult SNCO, who delivered “Sir, with respect you heard the OC”.
Some individuals have a real issue and some people perpetuate the “them and us” idea. I have seen this amongst the upper levels of the WO cadre who appear to bear grudges from years of aggro in their own areas of the country. I have also experienced it from officers who wail to realise that we are (should) all just doing the same stuff for the same end-goals.
I do not doubt that there is a tendency for the SNCO/WO side to draw from the marchy, shouty personalities that are available, but the blame there is not exclusive. Many heads need to be knocked together. People also need to focus on what happen now (and correct it if necessary), while not clinging on to what happened in years past. How else can we move forward?
On the basis that we have answered the original question, (It wasn’t right,) ascertained why it happened in the first place. (Carol is a fallible human), and devolved into a slightly heated discussion about SNCOs v Officers, I think this thread has run its course.
Of course, that’s not stopping anyone from starting a new one on that latter issue…
