Probably cheaper if we could piggy back on the CI card contract
ā¦but ID cards for cadets would be a huge admin nightmare
How long do they have to be with you before they get one?
How long would it take to get it?
Would it have to be returned when Cadet leaves?
Given that most cadets manage 18 months service - if it takes 3 months for them to be enrolled and then receive a card (generous estimate given how long most admin related tasks take for staff ids etc) they will only have them for just over a year before we have to somehow reclaim and return/destroy.
Since most cadets donāt even return uniform or come in to formally leave - just an email from mum after being chased - there would soon be a lot of Cadet IDs in circulation for non cadets
Well since the 3822 is already an ID document with just as many in circulation what difference does it make?
Adult ID cards donāt carry any of the information people are suggesting for cadet cards.
As it seems that everything (or as much as possible) is moving to e-systems, then we should, at every possible opportunity, do the same for the F3822 functions.
WHTs - not insurmountable - the SAAI should have the option for bulk āuploadā to SMS; for āred-flaggingā an individual, have provision in the e-system for this to generate a āwarning notificationā to the respective sqn. Enhance the functionality on the shooting side of SMS if needed. With the new CLF exercises, do we actually need to log number of shots fired? Each CLF has a specific number of rounds anyway.
Have a plastic ID for cadets, generated locally, minimise the (paper) admin as much as possible.
@Biggles_Lovechild not to mention losing them.
The one thing I would guarantee and bet my house on is that if we went for cards for cadets, HQAC would insist that squadrons buy all the paraphernalia and probably cards. Theyāve are past masters of dumping costs onto squadrons. But of course we get a Ā£75 admin grant if the CWC get their act together.
The āwhat if weāre in the middle of nowhere and we have no signal to access SMSā concern has come up many times during discussion of cadet ID cards.
Hereās something to think aboutā¦
If Iām running an event and I need to ensure that staff all have a valid first aid qualification, how do I go about checking that?
Staff donāt have a 3822 to record these things in, and they donāt carry their course certificates with them to camps/courses/eventsā¦ I look it up on SMS before the event.
Likewise if I need to check any other qualifications that staff hold.
Whilst there may be some occasions where the electronic system fails us I canāt really imagine itāll be the insurmountable problem which it is sometimes made out to beā¦ We already use SMS to check our staff records for events without worry.
1 Like
Projected savings on not having to print F3822s for the next X yrs = spread the money around!
Get them in Wg, about Ā£500 a pop + consumables. Once a month print run. Seemples.
You think?
OK so cadet going to camp on Ssturday says card lost on latter parade night. By the time Wing have woken up and decided to do some work, after coffee, biscuits, lunch, filing and painting their nails, it will be the following Tuesday.
Whereas 3822 gets lost or more likely washed, new one done there and then. I would find it hard to believe that sqn cdrs havenāt got a stash. I would say there are at least 5 or 6 pages that could be lost to no detriment to the book and in doing so reduce the costs.
I have to wonder as to why the 3822 gets changed so much, except for the sake of it to ensure someone at HQAC shows they exist.
1 Like
OK so cadet arrives at camp on Saturday and says couldnāt find my 3822ā¦
My point being: These sort of things already happen and have been happening for years. We deal with them. So whatās the difference?
Every time Iāve been CC or Adj there have been spare 3822s in the pack from Wing.
Not sure cards would be so easily replaceable, as I mentioned.
So?
Cadet arrives on camp with no 3822ā¦ You grab one from the pack and create a new one there and thenā¦ No photo, no WHTs, no 3822A from which to check the consentā¦ Itās worthless as a record and worthless as ID. How is that any better off than the cadet who has forgotten his ID card?
Iām not saying there arenāt potential occasions for problems with cards, Iām saying that there are already equally problematic occasions which we have to deal with - and the replacement of a paper 3822 with an ID card isnāt insurmountably more problematic.
You will have most personal details on the consent forms, as for the other bits cāest la vie as it has always been. In this day and age a photo wouldnāt be too difficult to sort. Weāve taken photos of cadets and printed them at the sqn when push comes to shove.
Right.
Thatās literally my point. The loss of an ID card is really no more of a problem to us than the loss of the 3822. A cadet turns up at camp without one of them and we are in the same boat. They have no ID - not a big deal. They have no record on hand of their qualifications.
We have medical and event specific consent on the TG forms and in either situation we have to check SMS if we want to know anything further.
1 Like
But donāt you also always lament the fact we have to do our own printing and scanning? And now youāre advocating that as the way to do things?
I get youāre trolling and, but at least be consistentā¦
1 Like
He is. Heās consistently inconsistent. Debates like a block of swiss cheese.
1 Like
Thatās if you have access to other squadronās cadets on SMS!!
Flt Lt Bloggs from 123 Sqn would not normally have access to cadet records from 456 Sqn!!
Flt Lt Bloggs from 123 sqn would have access to the details he needs for the cadets who are on the SMS activity he is on plus TG21/23. Failing that a quick text/phonecall to a member of staff normally gets info within a few mins.
I did submit a feature request to make it easier to get to the cadetās record from an SMS activity personnel list. I donāt know how it fares on the to-do list.
We should absolutely be able to see personal details like name and DOB and gender on the main list, and be able to check medical details and NOK information.
Ideally, clicking on the cadet in the event personnel list would take you to their record - just as when clicking on our own cadets in the main cadet list.
I spend much time (with a wing account at least which helps) trudging through the three levels of clickage to get to the cadet details when I need to confirm genders for accommodation bookings.
Correct. Had a cadet very recently who had managed the washing machine clean of their F3822 the day before AEF. We all survived.
Iām sure that a workaround is feasible; there is no need to throw additional obstacles in the way.