New 3822


#21

For the cadet the 3822 servers as ID.
As staff the 3822 is a quick way for me to refer to previous experience and to formally record qualifications easily. For example:

  1. I accompany cadets from three or four Squadrons on a flying detail… I go through the 3822s to find out how many times people have flown. This makes it easy for me to prioritise the flying list with those with most flights at the end. This is easily and quickly carried out during the coach journey.

  2. I can easily record WHTs immediately as I pass someone.

The ID factor could certainly be better served. The record of service could become computer only, but does it need to be?
Would it make it more or less hassle to record WHTs or to glance at peoples flying log?
I’d say it makes more work for the volunteer.

As for the new 3822s… I was very pleased to see that I now have far less writing to do when enrolling a group of cadets.


#22

This data needs to be on SMS and that need will be greater as the SMS activities system evolves. At best, the logbook would be a temporary place to note recent passes and that function could probably be solved in some other way.

“A 2015 UK driving licence” type of solution might work: a decent main ID with a paper counterpart for WHTs to be scribbled on.


#23

Indeed.

I worked in graphics for many years. Errors don’t just “creep in” between proofing and print.
Cranwell Graphics will have printed what they were told was ready to go… The error is because somebody didn’t proof it properly. Par for the course really.


#24

Yes, Id agree with that. There’s no reason that we couldn’t give cadets something like an F7257 really.

That said, it might also be useful to have a similar counterpart for other courses/achievements… In which case they could be incorporated together into a small book… :wink:


#25

That’s the point I was making


#26

A small losable, washable book! So few activities require immediate proof of qualification that the “record of service” element is best handled by some other means. It could still be a book like the current one but there is little reason to carry it at all times.

I like the 2018 version F3822 book: it is a good stop-gap until we find a better solution.


#27

Sadly, unless they go the expensive route of printing on plastic “write in the rain” type material I don’t think we’ll ever get past the “easily washable” problem… It just seems to be indicative of modern times that 50% or more of cadets can’t remember to take the damned thing out of their pocket. Bizarre really.

Though, I do agree with those who have said that there is still much which is superfluous and could be recorded elsewhere (such as on Bader only or incorporated into a better 3822A).
Such as:

The Home Agreement;
Classification dates,
Promotion dates,
Record of uniform issue (has anybody ever actually used this?),
Special Commendations and Awards,
&c

All the pages to record the dates of subject badge awards could disappear…

In fact, since people keep banging on about the “Cadet CV” I assume that it will eventually actually become something substantive; and with access to such via Cadet Portal there is really no need to use the 3822 for anything other than a place to record those things which staff might need to see at a glance (or where access to Bader might not be available) or for recording of things which require a signature.
Its use a form of “CV” is further negated by the fact that few cadets ever seem to bother completing the relevant sections. Even I rarely bothered back in the day.

As I really think about it, I’m not sure that anything beyond flying/gliding and shooting would be required.

The hell with it, just give cadets a 7257 (or cadetified version thereof) and a flying log book.

At a quick glance I count at least 25 pages in there which are unecessary.


#28

All this talk of electronic files, loses the battered book that old cadets look at with some fondness.
It seems a very selfish its too much hassle to write or look in a book attitude.
My 3822s not only reflect my activities and achievements, it’s also a potted history of the staff who signed it, something that you don’t get from some electronically derived characters on a screen or printed page.

I’ve spoken to a number of old cadets who have spoken about looking at their 3822, found in a box or drawer and what it represents to them. Even my old mates are the same.


#29

I was a cadet. I don’t look at my 3822 with particular “fondness”. It sits in a drawer somewhere and I haven’t opened it in over 10 years.
Same with my old National Record of Achievement from school (which is probably the closest parallel to the Cadet CV).

If I do open my 3822 I know what I’ll see… A book which is basically empty.
I have all the memories of the great times at the various events which I didn’t get around to writing in.

It’s hardly a selfish attitude since it’s not the staff who are supposed to fill out most of it. Given that the cadets can’t be bothered to complete the sections I don’t think many of them will be missing out.
If at the end of their service they instead get a CV to show everything they’ve done it can serve the same representation and nostalgia.

We need to remember that these young people have grown up in a different world than those of us before them… An electronic world where far fewer things are scribbled down on paper than they used to be.


#30

I’ve an old pair of socks I.look at in fondness at, all the walking I did, all the trips to bathroom at night all the beds I slept in etc. The cadet log book is a waste of time, firstly I hear that CCF have some type of ID card secondly everything a cadet does is on SMS, from flying to shooting to camps to First aid, yet staff are expected to waste time doing the same by filling in a book, cadets lose them which means you have to start a new one.


#31

One problem with the new 3822 is the page changes! Our unit had a enrolment recently and the cadets were told to go to page 7 and read out the promise. There were lots of very confused cadets as the promise is now on page 10! All was well apart from a red faced CO who didn’t check!!


#32

Are the page changes really a problem?

I have laminated A6 cards with the promise on for enrollment. One side the regular promise, one side the religious version.


#33

Not a problem at at, just an anecdote on how ill prepared the CO was!!