I call it CYA not admin reduction.
Depends on the wing
Our wxo doesn’t give you a thing other than the time of the buses if he has remembered to book them.other than that the CC is on their own and are responsible for supplying everything from there on in.
I’ve never been quite able to ascertain what the expected outcome is from all this? Is it a cadet(s) thrown out of the ATC?
That was never my intention, my intention was to prove the accusations against my children were false
So there wasn’t an essay or full-blown statement from all concerned written in the camp log, as suggested it would have been little more than a couple of notes to say something happened and it was dealt with.
When an incident was reported up the chain of command should there not have been a paper trail??
As I said what if the cadet in question had carried out the threat and attempted to suffocate my child in their sleep?? Would that also not have been recorded??
I think also a bit more of a sensible approach would be to say to your child, people say all sorts of things.
This was done after they were singled out and treated differently on their return to sqn A, AFTER to CO of the sqn only had my 2 in the office and said if anything happened with cadet M my 2 children would be removed - what about cadet M? He obviously had listened to them, why not my children? Why assume it was one sided against cadet M when if fact cadet M was the instigator??
given your child is still alive
So if my child had been suffocated and I ended up at their funeral, would that have been a better time for me to ask for advice??
I would assume that the other cadet had been spoken to by the OC and most likely told the same thing. do you have anything to prove that he didnt sit down with Cadet M?
If i had a cadet move to the sqn who had history like this, i would be telling both parties that i would not accept any incidents between them. Regardless of who was at fault in the first instance. I have seen many times bullied become the bully.
Depends on the incident, the context and more importantly how it was reported and who too. Remember that as staff we are still human and do make mistakes. I have dealt with a few too many “Threats” over the years, one ended up with the police and another was a quiet word of advice, each incident is very different and i may as the man in the big chair deal with it too harshly or too leniently and can only go off what i am told.
If that is the case then the OC should have a record of this conversation; if nothing more than to cover them just in case.
1 Like
It would need to be something fairly serious and in the first instance, unless I was requested to do something. As is in this instance it was dealt with at camp and in this case if I had been made aware I would have made my displeasure known and how the squadron has been let down.
Anything that happens off squadron, is something for parents to deal with, which I have explained to several parents over the years. I’ve had parents come in and tell me things have been said / happened at school and on the street, which I am unsure where we have any jurisdiction. In my view this is a civil matter.
Please tell me that you’re not actually in charge of cadets, and you’re just trolling.
4 Likes
I don’t normally agree with ‘outing’ people on here but surely this person needs identifying and removing from post.
All incidents (except the phone call) happened while under ATC supervisions, the threats at camp, the nastiness towards my children on their return night, the name calling - all happened under ATC supervision.
When I inquired about if the CO had a conversation with cadet M he claimed he didn’t feel it necessary - which to me means he knew of the incidents and sided with cadet M rather than gathering the facts - on their frist night back why just have my 2 in the office when he issued his ‘any problems and you’re gone’ command - why not have cadet M in the office as well??
The CO told me he didn’t feel it was necessary to speak to cadet M until I bought up the issues experienced on their return night about how they felt singled out by him telling them that any issues would mean they needed to be removed - surely he should have had all 3 cadets in at that point to get the point across??
An incident where my child is threatened, that incident witnessed, a witness asked to write a statement means that at some point it was serious enough to be reported on - why now is there no written report? no paper trail? nothing apparently!!
A threat of suffocation in ones sleep to me is a threat against my childs life and in my eyes serious enough to be documented!
For what it’s worth, I don’t think the majority are disagreeing with you about the severity of the original situation you have described.
Most of us are caught up in the apparent mishandling of the aftermath - either through obfuscation or ignorance it would seem.
I want to have a proper re-read before saying any more and now is definitely not the time for that!
2 Likes
For what it’s worth, I don’t think the majority are disagreeing with you about the severity of the original situation you have described.
Thats what I originally asked for advice, but put the past situations and issue into my original post so people people who offered advice knew what i was facing!
I’ve heard nothing since providing the CO with the names of the cadets who accompanied my youngest to the camp office and the witness.
My eldest has returned to sqn A and says the atmosphere does seem better - still slightly frosty towards them but better that the original night they returned back in January, and the cadet in question has been giving them a 'wide berth@ (if you get me) my youngest, however is having second thoughts about returning, despite how much they love it.
When was that? Has it been a few weeks, month?
If your eldest has gone back and is living with the situation good on them, and they and the cadets from last summer’s escapade are giving them a wide berth, as that’s what you do in life. It would appear the younger sibling can’t get over it and this is what I feel is fuelling your need for something to be done and is in turn fuelling your youngest child’s anxiety. If they see you are able to move on, maybe they will. I would feel continuing would prevent them doing other things. This is ONLY Air Cadets and like any hobby only forms a few sentences in a personal statement.
I doubt the CO has taken sides, unless he has no life. When cadets bicker, argue or whatever I don’t take sides in any way, as I have more important things to worry about than teen angst, I’ve been through that and now have 20s angst.
I’m amazed the OC told you he hadn’t spoken to the other cadet. If a parent asked me if I’d spoken to or what I had said to a n other cadet or their parents, they would get a very, very short a short answer. If nothing else it’s confidential. I could imagine you wouldn’t be happy if he told anyone who asked what he said to you and yours. I would query why you’d want to know. What I say to cadets is between me and them and not to be disclosed, except to staff, just so they know what’s going on and don’t drop one.
You need to speak or have spoken to the LA as they are legal Guardians, not the carers as they will have to refer to the Social Worker about anything going on like this. If it is correct that the people collecting the cadet wore “ominous Social Service badges” they may have been at those times in a “home” not a placement.
I have had 3 foster kids as cadets and each time I have asked for a meeting with the social worker ASAP, so I know what I can or can’t say or do. Their names couldn’t be mentioned in any sort of press release or website article and they couldn’t be in any photographs, in the days before we asked for photo permissions. What you have seen is a child who will in all probability have come from an extremely dysfunctional family set up, with lots of moving around within the family and then between carers, which could well mean moving many many miles from their home town. Friends of ours fostered children for 23 years (while bringing up their own children) and they had placements ranging from a few days to 2½ years and several who they told us, had been given new names.
What would your action(s) and expectation(s) be if this had been with the same circumstances
At school
On the street
What would your action(s) and expectation(s) be if this had been with the same circumstances
At school
On the street
The school my children attend have a zero tolerance approach to bullying and it would have been sorted and stamped out within about a week.
Especially given there was a witness to the threat of suffocation in my childs sleep!
If it had happened on the street I would have attempted to identify the child in question to go and address the parents and possibly police if nothing got sorted - are you aware how many kids commit suicide daily due to bullying that starts just like this - by people saying ‘oh ignore it, and kids will be kids’??
In this case because the bully is a fostered child and as I said previously I have never seen the same person drop them off or collect - how was i supposed to address the situation with the carers/foster carers?? I’m not telepathic, and by the time the child had got into the car of whomever was picking them up they were driving away!
2 Likes
PM sent
Hi nette_louu,
Keep a copy of all the replies posted on this forum, There have been several comments ranging from “get over it” to ‘If me and my brother blah blah blah’ The RAFAC have a ZERO policy on bullying and if those in command are not upto enforcing that policy then maybe they are in the wrong volunteer sector and not capable of a command post. As your other half was a regular, have you tried using the old boy network?
CFAV are no longer held accountable under Military Law hence the new plastic commission. Remember bullying is what is interpreted by the victim not the aggressor or anyone trying to tell you otherwise. I cannot believe that the threat to suffocate your child whilst sleeping has been given the brush off. TOTALLY unacceptable from those on this site and RAFAC as a whole, whilst cadets are in the care of the ACO and their representatives THEY have a duty to ensure the safety of all personal at an event. Good luck.
Who could that be, I wonder…
5 Likes
Thank you for your all your advice, I am glad to say that both my children are now settled back in and that the cadet in question is no longer there.
The sqn eventually took me seriously and sorted it out, but i was not the only parent concerned by cadet M’s behavior, several other parents and cadet spoke to the sqn about cadet M.
Then suddenly they stopped coming to parade nights, despite their name still being on the cadet list.
As I said from the start, this was asking for advice about whether or not the sqn had done the correct thing in their handling of the situation as I felt it was a little too blasé, i wasn’t aiming to blacklist anyone or the sqn which is why i purposely left out any ID.
Again i thank everyone for their advice, it was appreciated and helped so much in getting things sorted and check correctly
1 Like
out of interest
1 - do you feel the situation was handled correctly?
2 - Has the desired outcome been reached and with the benefit of hindsight has the route to get there been correct?
do you feel the same outcome could have been achieved via different means or a different route?
ignoring the element of time (ie it could have been quicker - we’re all volunteers and things take time) what would you do different should it happen again?