We just Phoenix half and halfs or 9 seater cars.
(Although, almost had an accident last night driving a bloody automatic. I keep forgetting it’s a brake not a clutch.)
Thats fine, but the place we would have to go to collect Phoenix Vehicles is often where we are going in the first place!
Get them delivered to you at your address?
They won’t do that down here, they insist we collect from the Station. (Won’t even deliver to the TA Centre we are based out of). I know what the rules are and have quoted them at length but they still insist!
Besides they won’t give us phoenix vehicles for all the things we need a vehicle for, (plus we only have 1 member of staff with a D1). An SOV gives us the flexibility that we require day to day, which is reflected in the fact that 7 out of 8 Squadrons operate them. (The 8th can’t afford to buy one but are working on it.)
Oh, so it’s a little empires thing! Madness.
Yep I assume so!
But it still wouldn’t be overly practical as we would need one almost every week and my D1 driver would soon get hacked off with never having a weekend off! (Or we would have 2 50/50’s and would double our staff requirements!)
well yes but is that not true for most cars/vehicles?
we (the organisation) only operate 2/7 days anyway so it would be difficult to be using the bus 5/7 days.
as stated the bus is moved every Sunday for Wing Training Jan-July at least one other day for Wing shooting and these are the repeating activites.
we have Staff Training Course, a local event, Cdt Training course, Wing athletics, RAFWARMA all coming up in the next 3 months where it will be used in addition.
i understand the argument for the it being a waste if it is rarely full though…but as a resource it is great for the Squadron
Weight is the thing people forget. Most 17-seaters are over 3.5t, and Transits way over. Annoyingly our school has just replaced a fleet of <3.5t minibuses with a contracted fleet of Transit 17-seaters and now we have a driver crisis. Still, the school is paying for the D1s…
We have bought one of these (as have at least 2 other local Squadrons and several local schools)
If you go for the middle option (so it has removable seats and a lightweight ramp) then the law allows upto 4.25 tonnes.
Who’s “they”? The Phoenix system allows the booker to put in an address of choice. The Phoenix system is a national MOD contract, not station, not wing, not region, not ACO, national MOD.
Then they is Wing as we don’t have the ability to book direct.
They’re talking out of their hoop mate. There’s no restrictions whatsoever. Your OC wing should be banging that tree for an explanation.
Agreed - we’ve had Phoenix vehicles delivered all over the country to meet our needs when we arrive. It’s a very good contract by all accounts (for the MOD!)!
Dawes I think we are in the same Region and our Wing has no such restriction - we have Phoniex delivered to home adresses, Sqn addresses, RAF stns, etc with no dramas!
@daws1159 must live in the roughest parts of the county and they fear for the asset 
*** on a serious note folks, if you own a ford minibus, they’re in high demand from criminals for parts. A wheelclamp, or old school steering wheel lock are advisable to prevent theft ***
I think it’s more someone being a cretin, might have to throw some teddies out of the pram.
Phonic is most useful in my opinion for getting vans to transport kit etc with SOV being the preferred minibus option as you don’t need a D1.
With regards to your point about theft of/from Ford’s, my daughters junior school minibus got done over last week - they took the windscreen…
Short words, Anglo-Saxon in origin.
I was more referring to the way various (individually relevant) rules and legislation apply, not saying the two were akin or linked
There is a web entry about this and suggesting D1 training at Leconfield.
The ruling is not quiet clear but a you would expect, as far as HQAC is concerned the matter is top secret.
I dont think there is much of an issue with Sqn Owned minibuses, but I will gthorw this into the arena.
All MOD white fleet vehicles or provided and operated by an FM Company who hold a PSV Operator licence with an appropriate number of O discs.
Military personnel re exempt certain rules, but ACO are civilian not military.
I have also read somewhere that the fact a Cadet pays to attend camp, which brings the benefit of transport to various venues, this could constitute ‘hire and reward’ It could then be argued that the driver should hold a PCV licence, be subject to medical, subject to periodic training (CPC) and also be subject to tachograph laws, thus needing a digital tacho card, and become subject to the working time directive.
That generally preclude use of any MOD white fleet vehicle without appropriate qualification.
Aries
ATION,KIFICATIPOJALIFIC ATIOhtotu nAY mod WSHITE FLEET VEHIOCEL BLLY \erallty preclude
But the fuel for the vehicle is paid for by an accounts 4 and as such comes from Public Money, not the money the cadet pays for camp. Same can be said of any local activities where the minibus is paid for out of Squadron funds, which are raised through fundraising.
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