Odiham has been tented for years. If we’re expecting the cadets to be out in 12x12s for the week, then it should be fine for the staff. If we’re saying it’s not ‘appropriately rested’ for the staff, then it’s not good enough for 6 nights for the cadets, IMO.
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This, really, I guess.
The original question was a musing, based on a different issue with a specific camp which I won’t mention but which did surprise me - going beyond the usual ‘sorry, no accommodation available in the mess’.
For what it’s worth (and I’ve probably said it on here before) I think it would be helpful if CFAVs were allowed to book accommodation directly for summer camps. If the ACLO goes to the accommodation cell and says ‘can I have 8 rooms in the Offrs’ mess for four weeks in the summer’ the answer is very likely to be no. If each individual officer books their own, there’s a chance at least some will get rooms.
I’ve done Odiham in tents - twice, in fact, in consecutive years, 2018 and 2019, and in 2019 we had a small number of rooms in the mess (2 or 3?) which I allocated to junior officers and the female staff member (as she had the worst duty rota); all officers Flt Lt and above slept in tents. As Camp Comdt I slept in my own 2 man tent out the back of the admin tent. I’m sure you would all do the same.
No circumstance other than the correct people being in the correct mess is acceptable, either Reg or RAFAC.
You want to tell that to RAF Benson, who accommodated me (Officer) in the WOs and Sgts mess one year, and made all officers eat and use the bar in the Sgts mess on another visit.
Sometimes, you’ve just got to play the cards you’re dealt with.
My God … I bet you had to use steel cutlery and eat strange foods …nuggets and I believe things they call chips!
…I expect no G&T in the bar …just Pale Ale?
…oh the suffering …
(very much tongue in cheek! 
)
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Coming from a Wing who has banned drinking for everyone unless it’s a 100% staff only course:
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Cadets aren’t expected to drive or deliver high risk activities however.
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I think in this case that is irrelevant. If the sleeping conditions are bad enough that a CFAV can’t safely deliver RtL training because of it, then the conditions are also not good enough for children to be sleeping in for a week.
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I’ve had terrible nights’ sleep in shared blocks on the DTE, and then run activities, so a tent might actually be better (I like @tmmorris’ idea!)
I had no issue with the tents at Odiham at all! I was there as a cadet, 6 (or 4?) of us per 12x12 if I remember correctly. It was fine.
We were kept awake a bit by Chinooks doing night training. But that would have been the case if we were in hard accom anyway.
Biggest issue was having to walk over to the ablutions across the sports field by the old runway! Funnily enough you can actually see the Odiham tent setup on Google maps…
When I went I’m pretty sure we had a lot more than that though. I distinctly remember two 18x24 as our admin tent and another for general use.
I have very faint memories of my RAF Odiham camp, as it was in 2002, but it was tented back then as well and worked fine. We were in a different location, as we were right next to a path, but I don’t remember specifically where we were 2 decades ago…
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I remember doing a camp at Lossiemouth in tents as a cadet, and I vowed from that point onwards to never do a camp if it is tented.
I’ve stuck by that rule as staff, if it isn’t hard accommodation I’m not going.
Doing OASC with a colleague staying in the transit accommodation and using the candidates mess we both agreed that if this was our first impression of our future employer we would have both left and gone home and told them to stick it.
I wasn’t expecting a Hilton style experience by any stretch, but DOM is as basic as I think is really acceptable (to me!). So that rules a lot of camps out for me!
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I did Coltishall in tents way back when and it was…ok.
By far the bigger issue is the lack of stations and even less capacity to host cadets. There’s no reversal for that, the summer camp of old is dead and buried.
I hear you.
But I promise you the reserve forces are feeling it even more, with some doing monthly weekend training and 2 weeks of ACT and never getting out of transit even once.
It’s not fair, and massively affects the experience, but who gets the good stuff if not the people who live there full-time?
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Well will there be enough 12x12s available this year?
That’s the burning question
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I see what you did there.
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An enlightening answer…
This isn’t a recent thing, it’s been going on for years. If there is availability in the mess then you get a room, if not then you’re either in an annex or a tent however, you ‘should’ be able to use all the facilities in the main mess ie bar, anti rooms, dining rooms etc.
As far as I’m concerned, if you are on an annual camp you are a guest of the station. If there aren’t any rooms available then just make do with what you’ve been offered. I have had an instance where a WSO would not accept the fact that he didn’t have a room in the mess and insisted on one. He was promptly put in his place and ended up paying for a B&B out of his own pocket.
Unfortunately too many visitors to the mess expect too much and are very demanding. This doesn’t help the cause and just prevents annual camps from getting what they need.
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Can’t get the quoty stuff to work but this is @Scrounger
If that were true, then I wouldn’t have a problem with it. The issue is where it’s not true (I won’t name stations, but trust me, I have proved it false in the past) or where there is an attempt to deny CFAVs use of mess facilities. Also, ablutions shouldn’t be shared with cadets so if use of mess ablutions is possible, that’s the preferred solution.
That’s just not true, though. CFAVs on duty on camp are Associate Members of the mess (RC North has confirmed in VoP that this has not changed with the CFC). That doesn’t entitle people to behave like idiots, of course.
Agreed. But that’s surely an issue for Camp Comdts to deal with directly. Usually one of my first moves on camp is to give the SWO my mobile number and ask him to call me directly if he has any issues with my cadets. It defuses many complaints before they get overheated. Maybe I should do the same with the mess (SLIM? PMC? who would be best?)