I have very faint memories of my RAF Odiham camp, as it was in 2002, but it was tented back then as well and worked fine. We were in a different location, as we were right next to a path, but I don’t remember specifically where we were 2 decades ago…
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I remember doing a camp at Lossiemouth in tents as a cadet, and I vowed from that point onwards to never do a camp if it is tented.
I’ve stuck by that rule as staff, if it isn’t hard accommodation I’m not going.
Doing OASC with a colleague staying in the transit accommodation and using the candidates mess we both agreed that if this was our first impression of our future employer we would have both left and gone home and told them to stick it.
I wasn’t expecting a Hilton style experience by any stretch, but DOM is as basic as I think is really acceptable (to me!). So that rules a lot of camps out for me!
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I did Coltishall in tents way back when and it was…ok.
By far the bigger issue is the lack of stations and even less capacity to host cadets. There’s no reversal for that, the summer camp of old is dead and buried.
I hear you.
But I promise you the reserve forces are feeling it even more, with some doing monthly weekend training and 2 weeks of ACT and never getting out of transit even once.
It’s not fair, and massively affects the experience, but who gets the good stuff if not the people who live there full-time?
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Well will there be enough 12x12s available this year?
That’s the burning question
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I see what you did there.
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An enlightening answer…
This isn’t a recent thing, it’s been going on for years. If there is availability in the mess then you get a room, if not then you’re either in an annex or a tent however, you ‘should’ be able to use all the facilities in the main mess ie bar, anti rooms, dining rooms etc.
As far as I’m concerned, if you are on an annual camp you are a guest of the station. If there aren’t any rooms available then just make do with what you’ve been offered. I have had an instance where a WSO would not accept the fact that he didn’t have a room in the mess and insisted on one. He was promptly put in his place and ended up paying for a B&B out of his own pocket.
Unfortunately too many visitors to the mess expect too much and are very demanding. This doesn’t help the cause and just prevents annual camps from getting what they need.
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Can’t get the quoty stuff to work but this is @Scrounger
If that were true, then I wouldn’t have a problem with it. The issue is where it’s not true (I won’t name stations, but trust me, I have proved it false in the past) or where there is an attempt to deny CFAVs use of mess facilities. Also, ablutions shouldn’t be shared with cadets so if use of mess ablutions is possible, that’s the preferred solution.
That’s just not true, though. CFAVs on duty on camp are Associate Members of the mess (RC North has confirmed in VoP that this has not changed with the CFC). That doesn’t entitle people to behave like idiots, of course.
Agreed. But that’s surely an issue for Camp Comdts to deal with directly. Usually one of my first moves on camp is to give the SWO my mobile number and ask him to call me directly if he has any issues with my cadets. It defuses many complaints before they get overheated. Maybe I should do the same with the mess (SLIM? PMC? who would be best?)
SLIM, PMC, OIC, all valid options depending on the size of unit you’re at. I know I’d welcome any outreach in that regard.
Also presents an opportunity to welcome you to the mess and make you feel at home.
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But it isn’t a recent thing. It’s been going on for the 30 odd years I’ve been in the Corps. I’ve slept in a tent, annex and in the mess. I’ve also stayed in a family house with 6 beds in when at Wittering.
But you are a guest of the station. It’s not your parenting unit nor your permanent place of work therefore you’re classed as a visitor. I’m not talking about mess membership in any way but you are talking about accommodation. As an example my Boss is off on a course at the one of the larger RAF stations and has been put in an annex as there aren’t any rooms in the mess available. If you come across as being a demanding throbber then you deserve to be treated like one.
I agree that staff and cadets should not be sharing ablutions hence the reason why they should be able to use the facilities in the mess. In the case where there are no options other than to use the same facilities as cadets then strict usage time should be adhered to with signs clearly showing that the facility in question is being used.
When I used to CC, I always made an effort to go and see the mess managers of each mess on day 1 and letting them know that they should contact me if there are any issues.
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Where is it actually written down that RAFAC staff are associate members? I’ve never actually seen it written down
It was discussed at length during the move to the CFC. I note that this document specifically states “Membership of the Messes, including entitled rates (when on duty) will remain.”
I think the ‘proper’ answer to this, as in a proper policy, will be deep in the QRs.
Extremely unfortunate, would have been great to know where it is for when we’re having these battles against certain stations
AP3223 Leaflet 603 search mess membership on this forum
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I don’t see that the entire experience is as mentally and physically draining for a cadet. Consider as well that tented generally doesn’t get you “away”, and down time as an adult can be a different experience than a teenager…
I think there’s credit to the argument that staff need better quality rest where they can actually shut their brain off for a bit. They’ve got more to think about than the cadets do, and more responsibility. The driving example has been given - cadets can sleep on the bus but the driver can’t!
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I’ve stayed in messes, other accom, tents at Marham, and one time at Halton in the cadet block (might be the norm now, it was Mess before that).
It doesn’t have to be the mess, but I do now actively avoid tented camps.
Even in the block at Halton, at least you have a mattress and door.
I expect many places have issues these days with parts of buildings shut off as U/S. They don’t have the full time need for the surge capacity they used to maintain so don’t upgrade or repair.
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I don’t actually have a problem getting quality sleep in a tent as long as I’m not sharing - hence bringing my own 2-man tent rather than sharing with another staff member I didn’t know. (And hopefully that helped them too.)
I appreciate that driving cadets is a serious business, but we don’t want to overcomplicate this.