Flying next week

Just a brief one I hope. Currently all staff including myself are not free next week but we do have 3 spots allocated to us and I need to let the aviation officer know by end of play Monday if we can take the places. The question is, we have a 19yr old Cadet Flt Sgt (will be 20 next March) who has said he is free to take them if he’s able to. I’m not an acp expert and wondered if anyone could confirm if it’s allowable or not? It’s not ideal being during the week but our Cadets haven’t flown in years which is quite sad. So any bods in the know on the rules?


My understanding - Cadet should have business cover on their car to transport cadets. We’ve had a CWO who’s done taken cadets to events, so is possible. Also have a FS who is looking at getting it put on so she’s covered and can therefore transport cadets.

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Excellent thank you for that bit of info to look into :+1:

If they don’t have business insurance you could get parents to drop them off and have the Staff Cadet go as the Staff Cover separately.

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Why? They’re not claiming travel or pay.

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That’s why I said it was my understanding. I suspect this has come through another’s interpretation of paragraph 15 of ACP300. I’m happy to be corrected, but having been advised of the above, it’s what our cadets have been told.

Personally I think its rubbish that our more senior over 18 cadets cannot claim MMA for transporting cadets in exactly the same way an adult member of staff would. We’ve got 2 doing LEL who cant claim any mileage for driving to their training weekends, but adult staff can. Not great for them when they have limited funds :confused:

We’ve also asked if the member of staff from another Squadron flying the same day, is prepared to supervise them as well and got parents to drop off at the guard room to be met by that member of staff. Admittedly this was someone already known to the Squadron and a one-off

Is the issue the transport of the cadets or the need for an Escorting Officer?

ACTO 031 makes it clear that the EO can be a Staff Cadet:

”Cadets must be escorted by a fully appointed RAFAC Cadet Force Adult Volunteer (CFAV) or Staff Cadet who has signed PERS Form 5-01A (Staff Cadet Service Agreement Declaration) with valid DBS clearance whilst attending air experience flying. “

“Where EO are related to cadets attending air experience flying it is recommended that an alternative non-related EO also attends.”

Have you considered contacting other attending squadrons to see if their staff can act as EO for your squadron’s cadets?

I don’t see why this would be the case. The cadet is not staff so there is no way an insurance company could claim that this is work related travel. It is not business travel any more than it would be if he was dropping his mates off at the cinema.

I can’t remember if it is still the case but we were always told that we needed business insurance when claiming HTD or MMA because as staff the insurance companies saw it as another employment.

If the regulations state you need business insurance to transport cadets then that’s what you need? Doesn’t matter whether the driver is a cadet or not.

I guess the parents of the cadets being transported would like to be ensured that whoever the driver is would be adequately insured…?

but what would a parent’s expectation be??

MOT, 3rd party insurance, and taxed?

Seems reasonable enough to me - certainly if we relied on Parental transport to an event that is all i would expect.

why would a parent expect me to have more than that? and why would they expect me to have business insurance? do they expect the same for Cadet Johnny’s little brother James who is in the Scouts?

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This falls upon the responsible people within the organisation. If you know, for example that business insurance is required as a Sqn OC and you knowingly allow a journey to take place then you can’t absolve your responsibility.
For example Sect 143 Road Traffic Act, a use/cause/permit offence apart from all the other fall out that may result if there were an accident?

As per ACTO 150 para 6.3 - 6.5, it will be the driver’s responsibility to ensure that their policy will not be invalidated by the journey. They could argue (which is what insurance companies often do) that it requires limited business cover as they are providing transport as part of their role in the organisation.

Required by whom?

As long as your insurance company is happy, then one’s legal obligations are covered.

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I’m with direct line. They were bemused when I suggested that I would need business cover to drive cadets around, and told me I didn’t need it if I wasn’t employed by the ATC.

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Worms, can…

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you’d think so right?

check out this link…
(it indicates what position each insurance company think about driving for a voluntary purpose)

(paying particular attention to the RHS column.)

the next argument will be is CFAV duty count as Volunteering??

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again - what actually matters in this case is what YOUR insurance company thinks about YOUR policy!

Explain to them what it is that you do, and ask them what policy you need to be covered for it (in writing). That way it’s all above board, you’re covered and it’s legal.

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That’s fine, but if you have a cadet transporting other cadets in their private motor vehicle, as the Sqn OC you have a duty to ensure they are adequately insured.
The MOD has a duty of care for any cadets transported on any RAFAC activity, hence the stipulation in ACP300 as to what suitable insurance is.


“Suitable insurance” should be the instruction by itself.

It’s like the stipulation that you used to need fully comprehensive cover, which was clearly written by someone who doesn’t understand insurance.