My mummy tells me I’m very special
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Hang over from VR(T).
But also, time from flash to bang is much longer.
Especially factoring OASC, SC clearances etc etc
Are we set up to take people with no prior knowledge in as direct uniform entrants?
I would have a strict time periods for people to do other things, including those who have been in the armed forces, given the Air Cadets is a mile away from the armed forces and cadets have to be dealt with differently to adults. But then I’d have all “RAF” bods within the organisation do at least 2 years on a squadron as a GDB prior to taking their “management” air cadet role.
Direct SNCO especially, they would end up being shoved along the drill/discip route and I have pointed out on a sqn I don’t need anymore than one of these, when I have had at one point 3 of them. My God having kids didn’t prepare me for the childishness when I said who was the main man. I’d not experienced cadets behaving like these supposed adults did. If, if, we had a proper grown up system of this is what everyone does ie class instruction and different ‘roles/trades’ for people to ‘follow’ once they’ve done the general things for 3 or 4 years, it would be easier doing direct recruiting. This ad makes a thing of training volunteers, but it’s very vague. We have the “courses” in place so why not ‘advertise’ the fact, say what they are and the timeframes. Intriguingly there’s no mention of the time it will take from initial enquiry, getting started on the process and becoming a signed up member of staff. The way this is worded it’s peel up and get going, not peel up and then “hurry up and wait … and wait … and wait”.
I would sooner people join and find their way to a uniform if that’s what THEY want to do, rather than direct entry. We push/cajole too many into uniform, they then find it’s not what they thought and they vanish.
If they pass the boards they’d be no worse than some of the 21 year old APOs we already get.
And that should be an option. All we’re saying is that the documentation and links they’ve put out are incorrect in saying someone has to be when that isn’t the case.
You’re arguing a different argument.
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But then I’ve never been a fan of the 20 year olds going direct into adult uniform. I’ve upset a few and arguments with Wing about it, but they’ve done at least 2-3 years as CIs, gone into uniform and been much better than many of their compatriots and have lasted longer than a couple who did the much vaunted direct commission OC within a year or so and left the organisation a couple of years later.
Again;
I dont think we should stop them… But I’m not a fan of a cadet becoming a Sgt or APO on the Sqn they were a Cadet… I feel a temporary transfer to a suitable unit should be offered. I certainly wish I had gone to a different unit for about a year
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Offer? Yes. Enforce? No.
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At the risk of stating the obvious I assume the Recruitment campaign is for the ATC element of the RAFAC as, as far as I understand it, individual schools which either have established CCF RAF Sections or are establishing one will either have school teachers who ”volunteer” to lead or advertise individually to buy in expertise.
If we are therefore looking for volunteers for the community based ATC what is HQAC anticipating the role of Cis, SNCOs and Officers will be not just now but as our parent service transforms into a very different organisation by 2040? Perhaps nothing will change, perhaps everything will change?
Here, for once, I find myself agreeing with Teflon as far as his analysis of what the RAFAC is ; an aviation/aerospace focussed organisation that develops young people. If that is the case then the core values of RISE (and whatever follows it on) are, in my view, universally applicable and should be front and centre of what we do. If that is the case then everyone who contributes to the organisation (or thinks of joining it) should regularly self-check to ensure that they feel comfortable with and demonstrate these core values to the best of their (varied) abilities.
If we could agree those foundations then we should be able to determine how we want the various streams to contribute to developing young people. I would suggest that the flexible use of CIs would continue to allow people with particular areas of expertise/skills to make a positive contribution. Individuals who take on the role of SNCO should do so because the defined responsibilities and the opportunity to contribute to the youth development process match their own interests; the same should go for those who opt to pursue the CFC route.
I fear that as the Air Cadet offering appears to become more technically complex, with all the attendant checks and balances it will be impossible to find the people we need in the numbers required. Perhaps we need to look to provide that training to smaller numbers of cadets at an appropriate level above the sqn?
In terms of our “command” structures here again I agree with Teflon, while we may externally appear to be a hierarchical organisation all contributions should be equally valued; there is no place for an ATC version of the “Class Sketch” from the 1960s show “That Was The Week That Was”
Unfortunately, we all live in the real world, individual motivations for becoming involved with the ATC are many, varied and on occasions destructive rather than constructive. I fear that the answer to the ATC recruitment problem is likely to be summed up by the conversation between an Irishman in the West of Ireland and a visiting Englishman who asked him the way back to Dublin only to be told, “ If I wanted to get to Dublin, I wouldn’t be starting from here”
That’s why I said offer remember volunteers shouldn’t be forced into anything
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See I have no problem with this, it’s just about proper management of your new members of Staff. I’ve not had a Cadet go straight from Staff Cadet to Staff without them already doing a proper Staff role as a Staff Cadet, then giving them up to another unit doesn’t help my Squadron.
Technically it’s for both (plus VGS). Quite a few CCFs, especially in CEP rely heavily on external volunteers. For instance my contingent has
Contingent Commander: part time paid non-teaching role (also the DofE coordinator)
SSI: part time paid non-teaching role
Section Commander (me): unpaid external volunteer
Two section officers: 1 X supernumerary from ATC (teacher at the school who volunteers for no extra pay)
1x ex ATC officer who left his wing role and came to CCF (unpaid and no previous link to school)
We’ve had no joy with any staff cadets. They hit 18 and other things are more important to them. Not a complaint, I completely get it, but they are not the panacea they are made out to be.
We took a staff cadet looking to go as staff from another squadron and it was a complete train crash. That said, we’ve had one or two more senior staff move for various reasons and they didn’t work out well either… It’s put me off accepting staff from elsewhere for life!
Better to find and grow your own CFAV’s. At least that way they fit in seamlessly from the start. Only trouble is it is very hard to do!
Indeed.
It very much depends on geography.
Sqn in a university city or large employment town.
Then yes they might stay.
No… they most if not all leave at 18.
I’d actually go further and say “advised”. I’ve seen too many cdt -> staff not move and become institutionalised on that sqn, which can do more harm than good for everybody involved. There’s one or two sqns in the centre of the south coast where this was particularly prevalent at one point, and the cliques that it formed meant that no other unit wanted to even work with them
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Not me 
On a serious note though. I would also agree that a cadet going from Staff Cadet to CFAV should be advised strongly to try another unit for at least 6-12 months. I’d go further and suggest it actually be required in policy, unless there are extenuating circumstances.
If they are the adj and the unit has very few staff then that would be fine to stay. Or maybe they don’t drive and live just down the road from the unit.
Once you start making it a policy with big holes in it what’s the point? It would never work in highland wing for example as the Squadrons are far too spread out, so now we have a Corps Policy that doesn’t apply to a whole Wing and that’s before you look at all of the other exceptions and exemptions that would kick in.
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this is the issue - as @Cadet04 / @AlexCorbin have said, volunteers can’t be forced to do anything, but there are plenty of things in policy which effectively do cross that line
ftfy 
(changed its name on 1st April)
You make a good point. Maybe stick with strongly advises then.
But they aren’t volunteers yet 
They are leaving one cadre and joining another. If you really wanted too you could say you must change squadron or leave for 6 months. There would be no legal reason you couldn’t do that. But that isn’t the point anyway!
So a joke just like the RAF it’s self then 