http://https://twitter.com/ComdtCranwell/status/594153855715258368
Surely there’s absolutely no justification for this?
EDIT: PLEASE IGNORE. Totally failed with links and inserting pictures.
need i cannot answer
BUT why is a Sgt carrying a sword?
AND doing so without white gloves??
Officers only - Page 29 of AP1358C (1.07) is quite clear (my bold)
ok reading the comments below it would seem this is a cadet who won a “sword of honour” ok i have no issue with that
but why march with it???
Yeah, agreed. Well done to him on winning it but marching with it isn’t necessary.
Hang on chaps. We are forgetting one thing here.
They are CCF.
That says it all as far as I’m concerned!!
It is absolutely not unusual for a presentation sword-winner to then march with said sword in the parade at which it was awarded. How else do you then expect them to conduct a march-past and march-off? Hand it back first?
Re swords in general: There is a little-known NCO’s pattern that is used by RAF DIs when providing instruction in sword drill. They were never carried on parade.
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Fair enough, more than happy to admit I know nothing about sword etiquette.
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Yep let them have their moment.
There seems to be tendency to get hung up on the minutae while IMO missing the bigger picture. Which in this instance, regardless of being CCF or ATC, is that this lad and similar will have worked hard to achieve it and if part of that means marching with it so what. This probably isn’t the first time it’s been done, but maybe the first time they made the fundemental mistake of putting it on so called “social media” and allowing it to be picked up on and pulled apart by the small minded.
I’m sure that someone in need of an enema will be in touch with them.
Its quite simple to see what has happened here, its a CCF unit, looking at the formation he is the Colour WO. In the RN or the Army this position would carry a sword (not sure of the RAF). If you look at there image he is carrying an Army style Sword. So I would suggest that it is just crossed wires between the way each organisation works. Army Drill and they chose to put a CCF RAF kid in the post.
If he is the colour WO then they have no flight commander in the flight following him - looks more like he is the flight commander to me. That is based solely on that photo as linked above.
Whichever way, shame they couldn’t find someone to teach him how to salute properly with a sword. Again, this may be discrepancies between services.
Not sure but I suspect they have a sword of honour presented by the HAC, in which case it will indeed be an Army one. Short of banning RAF section cadets from receiving the award, it’s probably unavoidable.
Personally I avoid presenting ours on parade for the reasons stated above… On the other hand from the background of the photo this is clearly an event on school premises so I wouldn’t criticise them for doing their own thing; I’ve done a few things I wouldn’t do in public…
Well done to the guy for earning the sword of whatever…
But never mind him carrying a sword the state of the rest of them!
do they have any pride in what they wear!
[quote=“GOM” post=24738]It is absolutely not unusual for a presentation sword-winner to then march with said sword in the parade at which it was awarded. How else do you then expect them to conduct a march-past and march-off? Hand it back first?
[/quote]
Let us not think of the Sword as a ceremonial item but an award, a trophy, which it would seem is its primary role.
in that case yes, i would expect it to be hand it in first. it is common practice for an award winner to receive their award from the VIP, march off via a side table where the trophy/cup/shield/award is left and collected after the marching bit…
[quote=“steve679” post=24761][quote=“GOM” post=24738]It is absolutely not unusual for a presentation sword-winner to then march with said sword in the parade at which it was awarded. How else do you then expect them to conduct a march-past and march-off? Hand it back first?
[/quote]
Let us not think of the Sword as a ceremonial item but an award, a trophy, which it would seem is its primary role.
in that case yes, i would expect it to be hand it in first. it is common practice for an award winner to receive their award from the VIP, march off via a side table where the trophy/cup/shield/award is left and collected after the marching bit…[/quote]
Couldnt agree more. And the rest of them look shocking. One lad looks like he cant even hold that weapon let alone hold it correctly.
It seems to be everyone wants the flashy shiny gucci looking stuff/drill/attention. But cant even grasp basics.
I am a big beleiver in function over form, basics before the big flashy rubbish. He has had his moment, hes had his picture with the sword. Hes earned it. Hand it back and crack on.
I’ve seen one sword presentation where the recipient saluted normally, received the sword, photos, saluted with sword then marched to the table to give the thing back before rejoining the parade. It needs a little training but looks quite good.
Normally though: recipient approaches, salutes, poses photo with sword which is immediately retained (being sharp and expensive) before saluting normally and retiring.
[quote=“incubus” post=24752]If he is the colour WO then they have no flight commander in the flight following him - looks more like he is the flight commander to me. That is based solely on that photo as linked above.
Whichever way, shame they couldn’t find someone to teach him how to salute properly with a sword. Again, this may be discrepancies between services.[/quote]
You shouldn’t be able to see the flight commander in the image as he isn’t a flight commander but guard commander No2 and will be standing to the rear of the colour guard.
As for the salute its pretty correct, only correction I would make is for his hand to be slightly closer to the body and his hand to be slightly twisted out.
I suspect we are talking about the same thing but using terminology from different services.
Not the case for an RAF sword salute. Again, inter-service differences but RAF uniform = RAF salutes at the very least.
If it is a colour party it is in no formation that I recognise or is in any manual I have. Admittedly I only have Army manuals. To me it looks like he is just leading the squad behind him. I guess he is the “honour guard” (as they seem to call it) commander. Sounds terribly American. In these situations I prefer to nod and go “uh huh”.
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