Sgt (ATC) passed SIFT but still has to do SSIC ? Opinions Pls

Adult Staff Staff Development
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[quote=“zinggy” post=10605][quote=“noah claypole” post=10597][quote=“zinggy” post=10596]We have all been CI’s at some point so we know how it is.

What I was saying is that it wouldnt hurt for them to realise what we as staff uniformed or not give up for the ACO a lot of wing staff that do the job full time forget that for the rest of us its not a job.

The reason I brought up the pay thing was because of going to ATF it may take people longer to go do the course because they cant get the time off work even more so when you are are in a job that you dont get holiday pay for.[/quote]

If you read the DYER Final Report, Brigadier Plastow CBE is very complimentary about the CFAV and recognises the commitment made by them (us). Additionally, if you read the Air Cadet Organisation Strategy 2013-2020, you will see in it that the Commandant recognises and acknowledges the commitment and challenges we face.

Having met 2 of the Head sheds, I can honestly say that they both recognised the commitment and dedication of the CFAV - so what you’re asking for already exists. Whether your particular WingXO pumps your hand all misty eyed in admiration of your commitment when you go to Wing (or not), is a local issue.

TBH I call it doing the job under the terms to which I signed up for, but then there is a growing desire to be recognised for simply turning up, rather than for exceptional commitment these days. Even then, those types get on with it quietly.

The good news for you is that you will be recognised for turning up/continuous commitment - with a Medal.[/quote]

Maybe it is an issue with my wing.

As for a desire for being recognised lets face it its good for morale we all get days no matter what role you play when you feel like your being taken for granted by either wing or as TL says by the cadets.

I didnt join the ACO for a medal already have enough of them dont really want any more thanks.[/quote]

Take it up with the XO - it’s what they’re there for.

Recognition is great - which is why there are all manner of awards, certificates and a medal ((s)if you get a State Honour too) which provides this. CoC throw out their congrats and thats it. If you (people) want more than that, then I think you’re in the wrong game. As for Cadets saying thank you, from my own experience, it was only later in life that I realised how much I had got from the ACO and the dedication of the staff which provided some great opportunities. As a Young Person in the Corps, I felt that it was there for my benefit (and possibly the Armed Forces later), so staff effort was not a consideration as I probably viewed them the same as Teachers - there through compulsion.

I’ve not heard of anyone refusing a CFM - maybe you’ll be the first? Let us know how that goes.

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[quote=“glass half empty 2” post=10606][quote=“noah claypole” post=10597]If you read the DYER Final Report, Brigadier Plastow CBE is very complimentary about the CFAV and recognises the commitment made by them (us). Additionally, if you read the Air Cadet Organisation Strategy 2013-2020, you will see in it that the Commandant recognises and acknowledges the commitment and challenges we face.

Having met 2 of the Head sheds, I can honestly say that they both recognised the commitment and dedication of the CFAV - so what you’re asking for already exists.[/quote]
Words and fine sentiment are cheap and invariably empty. They’re hardly likely to say you’re doing a poor job are they?[/quote]

Do you think we (CFAV’s) do a poor job then?

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Theres clearly a large amount of thread creep here…

But, what gets my goat, is not the lack of thanks (quite frankly, I don’t give a toss about a pat on the back from the CoC - VRT or RAFR or otherwise) and can quite happy live without it, BUT the way that we’re treated like scout leaders when it suits the CoC and they want to distance us from the RAF, and RAF Officers (for the VRT amongst us) when they want to tell us to tow the party line and behave.

Which is it?!

I don’t worry about thanks, I don’t worry about people treating the ACO as a career ladder to climb, I just want support, and an organisation that works, and allows me to do what im here for - 1. deliver as good if not better, an experience as I had as a cadet - 2. enjoy it!

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[quote=“Perry Mason” post=10632]Theres clearly a large amount of thread creep here…

But, what gets my goat, is not the lack of thanks (quite frankly, I don’t give a toss about a pat on the back from the CoC - VRT or RAFR or otherwise) and can quite happy live without it, BUT the way that we’re treated like scout leaders when it suits the CoC and they want to distance us from the RAF, and RAF Officers (for the VRT amongst us) when they want to tell us to tow the party line and behave.

Which is it?![/quote]
Something for an entirely new thread, as it’s quite an empotional subject and my soapbox will need dusting off :wink:

^^^ This is the the essence of what I am driving at (i.e. crack on) and the basis under which I serve.

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Hello! :slight_smile:
(waves)

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Hello! :slight_smile:
(waves)[/quote]

You can’t really refuse a CFM… because it isnt offered/awarded to you, you’ve got to apply for the bloody thing!

Now you can refuse to fill in the application for it…

Would be nice if the recipient didn’t actually have to apply for it.

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[quote=“noah claypole” post=10630][quote=“glass half empty 2” post=10606][quote=“noah claypole” post=10597]If you read the DYER Final Report, Brigadier Plastow CBE is very complimentary about the CFAV and recognises the commitment made by them (us). Additionally, if you read the Air Cadet Organisation Strategy 2013-2020, you will see in it that the Commandant recognises and acknowledges the commitment and challenges we face.

Having met 2 of the Head sheds, I can honestly say that they both recognised the commitment and dedication of the CFAV - so what you’re asking for already exists.[/quote]
Words and fine sentiment are cheap and invariably empty. They’re hardly likely to say you’re doing a poor job are they?[/quote]

Do you think we (CFAV’s) do a poor job then?[/quote]
Slightly rhetorical question. Having been a CFAV for years before someone coined the term … no I don’t think that any of us do a poor job.

Could you imagine if CAC or an RC pitching up and saying to the staff you’re doing a poor job, they may think it but they’d never say it. Let’s face annoy too many staff and they’re potentially out of cushy number. CAC’s got to be one of the easiest jobs in the forces for £90K+. The only fly in the ointment is cantankerous volunteer staff.

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[quote=“Perry Mason” post=10635]
You can’t really refuse a CFM… because it isnt offered/awarded to you, you’ve got to apply for the bloody thing!
Now you can refuse to fill in the application for it…[/quote]
You know that and I know that but the CoC doesn’t always appear to obey that! :mad:

[quote=“Perry Mason” post=10635]Would be nice if the recipient didn’t actually have to apply for it.[/quote]I disagree - applying for it is the easy out for those who don’t want it.
It needs to work much as promotions do: HQAC spot eligibility and flag it to the squadron to remind people to apply if they wish to do so (and have a box for “no thanks” as a kind of positive confirmation of a negative answer.

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Hello! :slight_smile:
(waves)[/quote]

You can’t really refuse a CFM… because it isnt offered/awarded to you, you’ve got to apply for the bloody thing!

Now you can refuse to fill in the application for it…

Would be nice if the recipient didn’t actually have to apply for it.[/quote]

I wont be applying for one, any medal that you have to apply for is not worth having IMO if it was awarded that would be different.

As I said I dont really want one if I wanted medals I would join up again.

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Having spoken briefly to Sir Stephen Dalton at RIAT, he was hugely complementary . But again we were stood in the heat for an hour and a half saluting every 30 seconds :lol: He’s not going to slag us off is he? It is nice to be told you’re appreciated though isn’t it?

As for the OP, from what I’ve been able to find out Daz, it’s possibly more to do with commitment than making you do it for the sake of it…