Our OC has decided that civ com are no longer allowed on squadron unless escorted. Has anyone been subjected to this?
Also, we recently had a new member join us. Because she wasnt DBS cleared she wasn’t allowed on sqn at all, even though every other member has DBS & BPSS. As a result we had to hold our monthly meetings off sqn until her DBS came through, which took 5 months.
I feel like we are the only committee this happening to so id be grateful for any feedback
Escorted access for DBS cleared personnel is a bit harsh.
No access for the person without DBS is sensible and in line with our CFAV rules.
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He claims we can’t be unaccompanied with cadets, which I 100% understand. However, on committee nights we have to be "escorted " from the front door to our meeting room. It really does make us feel uncomfortable
Who can remember a time when we didn’t have CFAV recruitment and retention issues?
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I would say the policy (ACP 4) that would dictate what CWC can/can’t do escorted/unescorted is out of date, is it still has N/A in the DBS column for CWC members. With that said, this would be my 2 cents:
For “regular unsupervised access to under 18s” you need a DBS as far as legislation is concernted. Per current ACP 4:
Only formally appointed staff, CFAV and Staff Cadets, who have been vetted and cleared iaw the provisions of Reference A (PI 103 - Baseline Personnel Security Standard and Counter Terrorist Checks) and Standard 3 (DBS/PVG/Access NI checks), are permitted regular unsupervised access to cadets for RAFAC activities. It is the responsibility of all sqn commanders to ensure that the correct vetting and clearance procedures have been followed.
Members of the CWC fall under the CFAV category for ACP 4. I appreciate that might be debateable elsewhere, but it’s crystal clear within ACP 4:
Ergo, if you are a member of the CWC and have a valid DBS and BPSS, as is now mandatory for all CWC members, then you do not need to be escorted whilst on Sqn. You should be treated the same as any other CFAV who has a DBS and BPSS.
Now as for those who don’t have a DBS/BPSS who might be waiting for one to arrive, the rules are that you can’t have regular unsupervised access without either. As is quoted above. So it should be absolutely fine for a CWC member who is waiting for their DBS to attend a meeting at the Sqn. Arguably they could be unescorted, as it’s not “regular”. But best practise would say they should be escorted.
It would be no different to a visitor. We don’t ban all visitors unless they have a DBS. That would be silly. Per ACP 20:
RAFAC Sqn visitors without security vetting. Non-vetted staff and/or visitors to RAFAC Sqns are to be escorted at all times, by an adult member of staff that holds a security vetting clearance of BPSS, CTC or SC.
I’m sure the OC isn’t doing this to be annoying. Just being overly safe, which is the best way to be sometimes. But a quick skim through some policy and a bit of thinking about it would suggest their rules are a bit over kill.
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As a slight contradiction to what everyone else has said, While Civ Comm members should all hold a DBS (and it really shouldn’t be taking 5 months! Even 5 weeks would seem excessive to me these days) Civ Comm members do not hold a DBS with Child Barring Check. Source - MS Teams VoV
As such Civ Comm members should not be “unsupervised with cadets” but that doesn’t mean they need to be escorted everywhere either.
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My DBS last week. Visited Wing to have ID checks done, details inputted on system at 1620, cleared by DBS overnight (8 hours) and I was informed by Wing by 0815 the next morning.
Received paper DBS after 4 days.
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I think your OC is being over the top. Civ Comm need DBS and in our Region any new members going through the join process also need BPSS. DBS is taking between 6 and 10 days to get physical certificate through.
As an OC I have always embraced the pressence of Civ Comm. They do a lot for the squadron and are an essential part of what we do. I would speak to your Wing Chair to gain some advice on how to handle this.
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Our CivCom look after the majority of our contractor visits, so restricting access would put more work on the rest of us!
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I didn’t think civcom were permitted to hold keys?*
*except in the event of nuclear attack.
Do you happen to have a reference for that as it is not something we are aware of? 
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Something I was told rather than read but I think it’s to do with the need to hold BPSS or SC clearance. When I get a chance I’ll see if I can find it but it may be worth double checking with your WExO or WSO.
Is be intrigued to actually see a policy on this. Before everyone needed BPSS I know loads of people who were key holders without SC or BPSS. Including myself.
The only policy I can think of off the top of my head would be ACP 26 which dictates that key holders for OME or rooms containing OME need SC. Can’t recall seeing explicit policy for regular access keys.
Here’s the reference, which also means CivCom can hold Keys under the new regime of CivCom holding BPSS.
and for completeness, “Security Keys” aka alarm keys, arms chests etc etc
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So, CWC can hold then. As ACP 4 defines CWC as CFAVs.
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I have tried speaking to the wing chair, who advised having a meeting with the OC and sector commander. We did that, sector commander wasnt much use and just shrugged his shoulders and agreed with OC 
That’s a stretch as that is for safe guarding purposes & in other respects & policy they are categorically not CFAVs e.g. sms events.
Unless the security regs define Civ com as CFAVs I would say that they would be excluded.
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To be honest, I think the important bit in the statement is the requirement for DBS and BPSS, rather than the CFAV bit. This would have previously only been registered CWC, but now that is everyone.
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Just had my DBS done and exactly the same, ID checked by an RHQ yesterday and confirmed first thing this morning it’s clear.
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I guess you are down to what you feel is right and whether you want to escalate this. I wonder if the OC would allow a commercial pilot down to give a talk to the cadets as it is no different…
If you feel you want to fight the decision then go back to your Wing Chair again, if they don’t help then the Region Chair.
Failing that you and your fellow Committee have a decision point on what to do. Personally I would not alienate the Committee in this way as it is a sure fire way to annoy people and ultimately lose them.
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