Does anyone know where I can purchase a replacement banner case?
The squadron banners we have are from Newton Newton, and come with a transport case, rather than the style that you see in the drill manual.
Regards
CF
Sorry chap. I had to buy some leather material and gave it to a CFS who was a dab hand on the sewing machine to make oursā¦
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Does it really matter?
You go with what youāve got, if whoever is marking a competition (the only time to potentially get excited about such things) they can swivel afaic if they didnāt like the carry case. If they were that worried they could buy or make me one.
It does at the moment: a significant portion of the banner competition involves the ceremonial casing and uncasing of the banner and, being based on the RAF movements for colours and standards, assumes that the banner has a sheath-type case.
Our old squadron banner appears to have some with such a case but our new one did not: we got a cordura carry case instead.
Thinking about the movements required by the banner for casing and uncasing I cannot see how it can reasonably be adapted to permit a different kind of case and perhaps what is needed is some coordination by CACWO/TG4b/whomever at HQAC with the standard banner suppliers to ensure that ATC banners provided are both of a standard design and are available with a suitable case (ideally with a metal tip)
Squadrons not competing in banner competitions can do without easily enough but as we hope that more and more units will be putting in banner teams Iād say that something needs to be done to help us all out.
How many squadons have such a beast that comes as a standard item? It would seem that unless you have access to one of the suppliers of standards to the military, this would have to be a bespoke or handmade item (which could end up looking quite poor). Which for all but a couple of times a year when you might be doing a competition, is it worth the time/expense or hassle? For me personally no.
It does display a level of ignorance of what cadet units have, if the powers that be canāt adapt the competiton needs to what we have. In all my years of doing parades with RAFA, RBL, RNA and so on, Iāve never known anyone faff around with a ceremonial casing and uncasing on or off the actual parade/function. Just roll it round the pole, secure with the tassles and off for tea and medals.
[quote=āglass half empty 2ā post=9152]How many squadons have such a beast that comes as a standard item? [/quote]Obviously I donāt know but from the banners Iād seen up to a few years ago Iād be inclined to answer āmost of themā. It may be that more banners are being purchased from commercial outlets than bespoke manufacturers these days, or that ideas had somehow changed. The cases we are speaking about are not that rare and are the standard, proper kind of case for a colour, standard or banner.
[quote=āglass half empty 2ā post=9152]Which for all but a couple of times a year when you might be doing a competition, is it worth the time/expense or hassle? [/quote]Teh competition and the many, many instances wherte the movement needs to be practised, and the other occasions where you may want to treat your banner (which, lets face it, is something weād like to have handled with dignity) with a little more care.
[quote=āglass half empty 2ā post=9152]It does display a level of ignorance of what cadet units have, if the powers that be canāt adapt the competiton needs to what we have.[/quote] in other words, invent completely new movements rather than asking that units get what ought to be a relatively simple item to go with their comparatively costly banner and accoutrements?
One of the stated reasons for introducing the banner competitions was so that squadrons could improve the way that banners are treated (ie, move away from rolling them up and throwing them into a car.) This would have a direct and indirect effect on the ability of cadets around the country to care properly for the ATC banner, which should be afforded a great deal more respect than your local flag-on-a-stick. We are training for the time when we may need to use the real thing, and trying to embed a set of skills which we wish to have used across the Corps.
Of course the competition does fail in a number of important respects insofar as it is neither one thing or another: It includes a banner WO which is only used fore the Corps banner but does not involve paying complements to the thing (only the ATC banner is due them, but if we are practising for thatā¦), plus the ATC banner has (or should have) a chamois-leather cover on the astral crown - your unit banner will not have an equiovalent cover for its spear finial.
[quote=āglass half empty 2ā post=9152]In all my years of doing parades with RAFA, RBL, RNA and so on[/quote]are irrelevant. We arenāt dealing with their drills.
Donāt feed the troll ladies and gents. Itās becoming a bit tiring now.
A quick scan of the popular suppliers and there isnāt or doesnāt seem to be one available commercially off the shelf, ie a sheath type that only slides over the actual standard on its section of the pole/pike, when held in a carry case. If there is one can someone insert the link.
OM this isnāt tolling, I grew up as a cadet around SWOs and WWOs who were predominatley ex-Rocks and hotter on drill than the majority we have around today. If banner drill had been deemed a necessity we would have been doing it. One of my first roles as a cadet was banner escort, with rifles, and we never did any formal uncasing/casing. But we did a heck of a lot of armed ceremonial drill, which due to PC BS has been lost over the last couple of decades to the āordinary cadetā and has only been recently reintroduced but controlled by an āeliteā. If I felt it was something that added to procedings, ie the average parade we are involved in, then you can guarantee I would have cadets casing and uncasing the squadron standard with all due pomp.
As for carrying the ATC standard, if such a time was approaching it wouldnāt take that long to train a group up to do it. The majority of banner drill is around actually handling and using the banner in a parade context; marching, dips, slope, order, carry etc. I would expect that the majority of cadets will have experience of this. I donāt have many cadets who havenāt carried ours and various association standards at functions and parades, normally by request of the organisation.