Purchasing of DPM/MTP by Squadron

It’s always been a topic I know - so if there is another thread on here I’ve missed please point me in the right direction!

We work on a well issue DPM (although getting harder to source for free) and you can private purchase MTP.

I’m seeing a variety of things on social media at the moment from Sqns charging £30-£50 “fee” for uniform at the beginning and I assume (hope?) get it back when they leave.

A squadron using grant money to purchase DPM jackets - presumably they’ve not managed to get them for free from anywhere

DPM seems to be getting harder and harder to source, whilst full MTP (online - some Surplus stores are quite good) is really quite expensive.

To an officer who refuses to wear greens full stop since they aren’t issued with it and on principle won’t wear it but doesn’t prevent his cadets.

How are squadrons managing to balance it up without impacting the cadets too much - particularly in lower income areas?

We purchase and sell to cadets at cost when they join. It is their’s to keep and we don’t expect it back.

The Squadron has a ringfenced hardship fund that will cover the cost for those that need it, either in full or part payment.

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We threw out the remaining DPM we had. We bought a job load of MTP and scavenge some from our parent unit when possible. The civcom agreed I could buy some, but we don’t charge cadets for it. We essentially write it off and we know we will lose some, have to throw some out through wear and tear etc.

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We have a large stockpile of greens in general (DPM and MTP) that are issued out. We then speak with local disposers of formerly issued kit to source newer stuff.

Get in touch with your parent unit or call the clothing stores supervisor at Halton and ask if they have any PWS MTP. Go down in a van or minibus and fill it. Give it out to your cadets for FREE.

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This will vary unit to unit. Some will out right say no

You won’t know unless you try.

Everything from Halton is heading East at the moment

ATC cadets had to buy their service dress uniforms 80 years ago: this in an era when most of the British people were working class, so the ‘lower income’ and ‘just about managing’ argument against buying your own kit doesn’t wash, as far as I’m concerned. We in the UK are fabulously wealthy compared to nearly everyone in the world today. Plus there was a War On in those days - there is one on again now, of course, but the fighting of it has been outsourced. :v::nerd_face:

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Cheers dits.

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When we have people below the poverty line and can’t afford heating absolutely not making them buy any uniform. We do have a hardship fund to help them but sometimes getting them to ask for help is the most difficult!

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When I was patrolling out from Basra International Airport in 2004/05, we would often drive through the city’s rubbish tip, which covered an area of several square miles. People lived in it, in dwellings made of recycled local materials, and made their living by scavenging other materials for sale. That’s what I call ‘living below the poverty line.’
We don’t need as much heating of our homes in Britain as we used to, either: global warming is taking care of that one. Last winter wasn’t cold at all…although our houses have always been badly insulated and with inefficient heating systems - the Romans had better central heating for those who could afford one of their ‘exclusive luxury 3-5 bedroom homes’ during their colonisation of Britain. :thinking:

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Absolutely if we want to compare kids here to kids in other countries.

But should I penalise my poorer cadets because there is people even poorer elsewhere in the world?

We expect them to wear greens (I appreciate they are issued coveralls but in reality we do expect them to wear greens, and a lot of people would be embarrassed to wear coveralls because they can’t afford greens) so for me we should be issuing them in some fashion - whether that’s people are lucky enough to get it from station, or the squadron pays for everyone, or doesn’t allow to wear greens.

It’s why I was wondering how people balance it.

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Don’t feed the troll.

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Fair - easy hook, we’ve had some quite vigourous discussion at the Sqn surrounding the difference of home life and how cadets is an equaliser.

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We also have a bit of a supply come from our ACF unit recently.

Along with some other kit.

Might be worth building that relationship with your local ACF or RAF base. (If you’re nearby)

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I know: it’s a typically British grey area which needs a fudge of some sort to solve the problem, from those upon whom the rules are expected to be followed.
For example: some squadrons have cadets with parents who can afford it; some squadrons scrounge off the RAF; our squadron had a load of CS95 uniforms donated when our local CCF unit started wearing PCS MTP clothing, and so on.
The real price of second hand combat clothing has come down over the decades: as a cadet, I started work at 16 with a local employer before I joined the Army at 17, and I bought a surplus 1970 pattern DPM jacket for ATC field training, which cost £20 of my pay, a lot of money in 1984. With the immense amount of army surplus gear being dumped on the market by countries’ either downsizing or modernising their military forces, one can buy combat jackets for around £20 forty years down the line.
And at least in the days of RAF/ATC service or battledress, that clothing was all made of wool serge, or wool flannel in the case of the shirts, which is warmer than cotton or nylon clothing, so that’s a solution to the winter’s cold.
In the miserable damp and chilly winter of the Arabian Gulf, one can at least burn plastic rubbish to keep warm: there’s plenty of it and it’s free, so in that way we in Britain can be envious of their lifestyle - no heating bills! :vulcan_salute::stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

Being relatively richer compared with those in other countries only matters if all the other costs associated with living are equal across those two countries.

If you earn £1000 a month and someone in x country earns £500, but you spend £900 of that on your rent and they spend £100, they’re richer…

I’m oversimplifying, but this is why the “we’re richer than we’ve ever been” argument largely doesn’t hold.

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Well, my Sqn has around 100 sets of CS95 uniforms we can’t even give away, let alone sell for knockdown prices in order to raise money for our fund: shame I can’t send it back to myself in 1982, where it would have been appreciated. :roll_eyes:

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Keep it in case DPM becomes a thing again?