Promotion Matrix

[Rexan]

@Chief_Tech

Now you can’t replicate the 8-12 years service a regular Sgt would have before getting to that rank, but it needs to be substantive enough of a process that when asked/challenge by a regular it comes across as worked for and not handed out in the cereal box. If there is not credibility then the soft support from the organisation (friendly sections, cast offs from stores, opportunities etc) will diminish.

You already get the uniformed rank after a few weekends of pre-uniform and a week at Cranwell working out which way up to hold an iron. Not sure we pass the cereal box test as it is!

But saying that, it’s completely irrelevant anyway. The RAF is the Air Power providing component of the UK’s defence forces. The RAFAC is a kids club. To blur the lines between the two I don’t think is especially helpful.

If a section is really going to limit a visit from some kids who are keen to learn about what they do because a staff member supervising said group of children didn’t spend long enough getting their (already markedly different) rank, do you really want to be wasting everyone’s time trying to visit them anyway?

Stores etc are mostly run by -insert miscellaneous defence contractor- with staff unlikely to know, or care, what the bits on the shoulders mean anyway. Assuming they have bits on their shoulder, imagine it’s a CI… Which would also be absolutely fine.

I’d still advocate that you could have two perfectly co-existing channels.

Want to be reasonably involved? Come on in, become a CI. Help out as much as you like.

Want to be a little more involved? Fancy wearing some uniform? Come on in, become a uniformed member of staff. SNCO, officer? Doesn’t matter. Run a squadron and you’ll do exactly the same regardless of what sort of hat you wear. Though this channel only works if the piles and piles of pre-course red tape are removed as discussed earlier. They’re ranks in a youth club, nothing more. They shouldn’t be guarded like they’re sacrosanct.

[Moist_Van_Lipwig]

@Chief_Tech

Now you can’t replicate the 8-12 years service a regular Sgt would have before getting to that rank, but it needs to be substantive enough of a process that when asked/challenge by a regular it comes across as worked for and not handed out in the cereal box.

With respect, I disagree.

We’re at real risk of worrying too much about what the airforce think that we’re not doing what is best for our organisation, and therefore our cadets.

CFAV are not in the RAF. The RAFAC is not the RAF. We can make our CFAV whatever we want them to be. It doesn’t matter that a CFAV can get WO at 28 - we’re not conferring RAF warrants on CFAV. Or commissions for that matter. If having 20 year old Sgts, and 28 year old WOs makes our organisation better, and allows us to provide better training for the cadets, then lets go for it.

@Chief_Tech

If there is not credibility then the soft support from the organisation (friendly sections, cast offs from stores, opportunities etc) will diminish.

In all of my 20+ years as a CFAV, I’ve found that being polite and respectful whilst interacting with the forces has gained much more than my rank ever has.

[Biggles_Lovechild]

if only our Lords and Masters would remember:

• This is a youth organisation
• We are youth leaders
• Uniform is a dress up part of what we do to make us ‘look military’
• Would be great if every Sqn had 1 Officer as OC and 1 SNCO for shouty/drilly bits - any other job can be Officer/SNCO/CI take your pick

Therefore, when we recruit we should base our decision on:

1. Would this person be a good Youth Leader?
2. Are they interested/would they suit being in uniform?
3. Which flavour uniform?

And we need to recognise that white tapes means ‘I know nothing - teach me’ - not I have some knowledge/skills but have not been in uniform for long. Lets use them for what they are - DBS cleared and able to supervise etc as part of a bigger team whilst they learn the skills they need for later

[Typhoon]

Exceptionally well put.

[Typhoon]

In general, I’ve seen a cycle of burn and replace especially at OC level, short termism at its finest. I feel maintenance of the OC (be they CI / SNCO / CFC) is essential and this requires effective support from Wing level to maintain and support that individual (irrespective of rank etc) to establish stability (which is the foundation of everything IMO) for as long as possible.

From stability a structure can be established and so too can contingency, we are all one bus strike away from irrelevance.

Ego, Ignorance, Lethargy are the enemy, but can creep in to the best of us depending on our circumstance. Our people are everything and so must be the primary consideration, as from such, all else follows

[daws1159]

@Typhoon

effective support from Wing level to maintain and support that individual (irrespective of rank etc) to establish stability

So how do you feel about binning off effective officers purely based upon their age?

[Typhoon]

I would naturally refer you to our organisation’s policy regarding the same.

[SJW92]

So now we’re a couple of months into the revised matrix/process, has there been any sort of clarity on what roles are deemed “WO rank essential” or is this basically being made up Wing by Wing/Region by Region?

[AlexCorbin]

Sits with the RC. Id ask your CoC

[Mr_OZ]

you don’t have an RC, What happens in SW?

[AlexCorbin]

No promotions ive had no WO promotions since the RC left so not sure. I have put it on the new RWO plate though

[MajorDisaster]

@Moist_Van_Lipwig

You wouldn’t ask a Plt Off to become an NCO, just because you have no one to teach drill on the Squadron, would you?

You can bet I’ll be applying to do the drill courses so I can teach a future cadet cadre now that non-commissioned officers can run units!

When I apply, and go through all the interviews, what is now the correct answer to “why do you want to commission?” Doesn’t seem to make a jot of difference.