Having not seen a regular solider or airman in CS95 for some time now and the local ACF have now had an issue to their staff I wonder when/if we’re likely to get an issue or the authority to wear PCS?
I know that Comdt AC is currently visiting plenty of Wing Conferences etc and I wondered if anyone has specifically asked the question? And of course what the answer was?
Shhh! No rush.
I heard that the next batch of JL’s will be issued with MTP PCS.
That’ll make em feel speshul.
she was at ours and the question was asked
her reply
give or take that was the be all and end all
it was explained that as we (the ACO) are not scaled for CS95 it will be hard to justify being scaled for MTP/PCS.
further explaintion indicated the new kit is a considerably more £££ than the outgoing CS95 and there are limited dollars available.
Sponsorship maybe a route she considers, approaching Marshalls of Cambridge for example for the sum of money to put us into MTP and if that requires a badge (identifer if you will) indicating our “sponsored uniform” from said compamy then so be it (to quote CAC) “i am not proud”
[quote=“merlin456” post=4104]I heard that the next batch of JL’s will be issued with MTP PCS.[/quote]Indeed - speaking to a JL instructor a few years ago, he explained that as it’s issued by the RAF once they run out of CS95 they’ll have no other option for issue!
I have a sneaking suspicion that the wear of MTP by JL may well be the ‘back door’ that eventually allows us all to wear it.
Indeed. I asked the question to her at our conference.
Her reply was as Steve’s above. There are no plans. She didn’t even realise we weren’t scaled for it!
She was offered MTP in her initial kitting and was told she should wear it (whether she does or not I don’t know, not seen her in anything but blue).
There is no plan for it. No money for it and it is on her priority list. I have no idea how much it would cost per person, or indeed whether we will have to resort to the current situation of beg, borrow or steal!
I don’t think there would be any cost in releasing an order stating that members of the ACO may wear as appropriate either MTP or CS95 pattern unifrom.
We’ll never be scaled for it (probably!)
As a CCF helper, I am told we’ll be issued MTP within the next month or so. As there are certain SATT types cutting about in it, I think I’ll start wearing mine…
Don’t blame you.
Don’t forget the mudguards!
…or the para wings…
she was at ours and the question was asked
her reply
give or take that was the be all and end all
it was explained that as we (the ACO) are not scaled for CS95 it will be hard to justify being scaled for MTP/PCS.
further explaintion indicated the new kit is a considerably more £££ than the outgoing CS95 and there are limited dollars available.
Sponsorship maybe a route she considers, approaching Marshalls of Cambridge for example for the sum of money to put us into MTP and if that requires a badge (identifer if you will) indicating our “sponsored uniform” from said compamy then so be it (to quote CAC) “i am not proud”[/quote]
I don’t think we’re looking to get it issued (unless the RAF wants to!) But, there’s loads of it in the part worn bins at local RAF Stations stores. Instead of it going to the army surplus shops, why not give it to us CFAV to issue to our Cadets?
CS95 is sourced though various means at the moment so why not allow us to start wearing MTP? CS95 is going to vanish soon, and then what will people do?
HQAC haven’t thought that far ahead.
It’s not happening for 15 course. Enough DPM has been scraped together to put it off for another year as there are other issues, with issuing MTP, namely keeping track of it once it’s been issued.
In terms of whether HQAC are aware of the issue, they are. I spoke to Wg Cdr Trg myself about it. But it’s finding the space in the budget which I think he said was the issue. (My memory’s a bit fuzzy)
My WO and I agree that we’re probably best out of it for a while, as it has to be rigorously managed once you have it, such as it all has to be accounted for if a cadet leaves. It isn’t being disposed of like CS95 was, so we can’t get it that way.
What gets my goat at the moment, is not so much the ban on us wearing the issue PCS, but the ban on us wearing any commercially produced ancillaries. It’s getting harder to buy new DPM accessories, i.e. all of Karrimor’s SF daysacks are only made in Multicam, Olive or Black.
Is there a ban? As far as I know, we’ve only been banned from wearing the uniform.
I’ll see if I can dig it out. It was definitely promulgated in my wing, maybe region… Wait Out.
EDIT:
I may have been mistaken, looks like I may be off shopping…
The wording of the ban did indeed refer to ancilliaries…but (intentional or not) that has specific meaning within the context of the PCS uniform. Equipment is not actually covered by the ban.
If they meant to ban MTP/multicam ‘equipment’ then they should have used that word.
As you say, multicam (or various other MTP-like pattern) equipment is readily available at fair prices, and in some cases DPM version are no longer being made. Personally if I were to spend out on something like a new camelbak, webbing, daysack, &c I’d prefer to invest in the future and not buy in a pattern that will soon enough be obsolete.
[quote=“wdimagineer2b” post=4164]The wording of the ban did indeed refer to ancilliaries…but (intentional or not) that has specific meaning within the context of the PCS uniform. Equipment is not actually covered by the ban.
If they meant to ban MTP/multicam ‘equipment’ then they should have used that word.
As you say, multicam (or various other MTP-like pattern) equipment is becoming readily available. Personally if I were to spend out on something like a new camelbak, webbing, daysack, &c I’d prefer to invest in the future and not buy in a pattern that will soon enough be obsolete.[/quote]
Exactly, and what is currently available in DPM isn’t exactly top of the range these days. Also, I like that everything is inter-compatible thanks to MOLLE, but it’s hard to get DPM kit with MOLLE ladders.
TBH, I’d just buy in OG - but I really can’t see any issue with MTP/multi-cam/etc kit if you want it!
Consider this: is it possible that the wrong questions are being asked about the wrong points?
There is absolutely no reason whatsoever for any Cadet organisation to wear a specific tactical pattern of camouflage, other than for reasons of uniformity. That could be within the Cadet organisation itself, or also out of respect/tradition follow-on from a parent service.
It’s completely impractical for the ACO not to wear some form of approved ground training undress field uniform. The logical approach would be (in the absence of MTP scaling from the RAF) to simply continue wearing CS95 surplus for decades to come. The ACO should commandeer every single serviceable item of unissued/PWS CS95, and keep it in a national stockade.
Other factors to consider: perhaps a capitation fee could be considered, specifically for issue of greens. Many other activities (school/sports/you name it) requires a personal investment in some items of clothing.
Consider the experience within the Royal Canadian Air Cadets. They are forbidden from wearing Cadpat (which we’ll just think of as being a CF equivalent to MTP), and the only formal field dress they can wear (along with beret and rank) is olive-green OG107. If they wear any other type of combats (apart from forbidden CadPat) they may not wear berets or rank. The Royal Canadian Army Cadets are subtly-different, in that they are permitted to wear a copy version of CadPat/‘MTP’).
But RCAirC Cadets all buy their greens.
If costs were cheap enough, and purchase channels were created, why couldn’t we just stick with CS95 for at least the next 5-10 years?? Practically-speaking, and with an eye to costs/disruption (badges, anyone?), there is no better/simpler smarter solution. If there was, we’d already know about it.
wilf_san