I mean, if we’re going to use medicals as an example; A cadet sadly died a few ago specifically because the RAF failed in their duty to do proper medical examinations. This is public knowledge.
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Thank you for agreeing with and backing up my point. 12 years ago. Which specifically brought in the enhanced checks we now have that civilian equivalents don’t.
How many incidents have BGA clubs had in the last, say, 10 years vs how many flights have they conducted.
Vs
Same numbers for VGS and AEF combined.
Without those stats, any extra legislation you care to bring up doesn’t matter.
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Irrelevant mate. How many kids have been killed in bike accidents in my town in the last 5 years? None. Shall we stop wearing bike helmets then?
It’s not down to maths - emotionally if you / your predecessor put a safety measure in place who is going overturn that.
Many cyclists would say yes. Whilst they do protect you more in an accident there is evidence to show that cars tend to give you more space if you don’t wear one and therefore you are less likely to be in an accident.
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That’s not my point. And you’re only saying it’s irrelevant because it would show just how bad we’ve become at providing flying opportunities.
Just having rules in place doesn’t mean anything.
All we want is for the air cadets to fly.
All we get from the organisation - and from people pertaining to be involved in flying - is excuses why we can’t.
We don’t want excuses, we want solutions. So far, every single fecking one of them is failing on the latter and we’re beyond narked about it.
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In many ways it is. If the evidence (probably in terms of mathematical stats) show that the additional burdens add little too no extra protection then it’s arguably reasonable to remove them, and you would probably have cover in legal action. We need to determine what is an acceptable level of risk and I for one day we’ve gone far too far.
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Oh really…
Sorry I didnt realise you were an AME (aero medical examiner). 
If an AME has any reason to require it, they can request GP records.
Furthermore they require by law that standards be met and suspend medicals if not.
If you are an AME, please PM me your ref number so I can ask the CAA to investigate, your standards. Ta.
This is a key question. You can’t bloat about risk without backing it up with figures. The risk is quantifiable.
Pointing at a piece of paper and saying ours is more important isn’t enough to measure or define risk in the real world as opposed to on paper.
Kinda is. It’s easy to point to a discrete number of incidents and call it “low”, but it’s the percentage that counts.
1 failure out of 100 is worse than 3 out of 1000.
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In my time in the organisation there have been a number of accidents some tragic. But the Air Cadets kept going in spite of and despite any media coverage. The mid air collision during AEF didn’t raise any comment among anyone who I spoke to about cadets outside “the club” at the time or since. So would anyone outside “the club” get excited for any longer than a few days if an aircraft from a flying school or BGA crashed and a cadet was killed or injured? Would it affect people’s children joining and fully participating? Never did and never would.
The most problematic incidents were Hungerford and Dunblane neither of which had anything to do with the cadets, but some parents cited them at the time as reasons to forbid their children doing shooting. But we weathered both of these and ironically it was the Corps that eventually put pay to shooting as we knew it. Never known anyone cite a reason linked to an incident related to flying in this way.
I am convinced the reason the MoD/RAF have blocked us using public flying providers has nothing to with any perceived or invented potential safety issues and all to do with an ailing RAF needing keep up the pretence it can provide flying as an activity, when they are and have been failing us in a way that is mind numbing given the RAF’s primary function and only keep going because it’s funded by taxation.
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Are you referring to Flt Lt Blee? The failure wasn’t in the standards expected, but that those standards weren’t upheld.
There are proper pilots around here who might confirm or correct, but my understanding is that the condition he had wouldn’t preclude even an airline captain as long as it was properly monitored and managed.
The other incident involving the two cousins wasn’t medical related.
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Correct.
To be clear, this can viewed on the UK CAA medical website for fact checking.
No pilot input required.
I thought there was an element related to a medical cause? Been a while since I last read about it though so I may be mistaken.
Anyway, gliding is going gangbusters now… loads of cadets flown.
Ps toodle pip and best wishes to all. It’s been a blast. Be careful what you wish for and keep smiling.
It would appear that someone is retiring from this thread because he’s been a) shot down in flames and b) sent back up and shot down again.
And no, there was no pun intended…
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Out of interest (open to anyone to answer as @Drainingtheswamp appears to have left) what is the difference between Class 1 and 2?
Realistically how much harder is it to pass a Class 1?
What I’m asking is, would these Class 2 medical pilots likely pass a class 1 but don’t go down that route simply because it’s not required?
My pilots license required a medical sign off but I’m confident I would pass a Class 1 but don’t need to so haven’t gone to that effort or expense.
Class 1 is far more Indepth. ECG, blood work full history check. I kniw someone who did most his Cpl on a class 2 went to get his class 1 for license issue and they detected a heart murmor and failed him.
Oh.
Ok…quite a bit more in depth then.
Interesting…
And perhaps now explains why a volunteer stops at Class 2 while an employee goes to Class 1
No, it isn’t. It’s a mediocre product offering a bare percentage of what it used to offer, with idiotic timings and an extremely poor coverage of the country.
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