“Do you feel fit and well” followed by a simple tick box along the lines of “Have you had or suffered any of the following in the past 24/48 hrs”. Signed by a supervising adult/parent/guardian, given to AEF/VGS provider, then destroyed.
That was all that was needed. :S Someone appears to have got the stick and run completely the wrong way.
Oh, and guidance to adult staff.
thats not what he’s saying - he’s saying that the AEF’s don’t give enough notice of timings so that he can firstly dish all the med forms out, get them back, send them through WHQ and do that all in enough time so that WHQ can then book sleazy-jet tickets that won’t bankrupt the ACO.
Last time I flew with easyJet, I must have missed the parachute briefing! :S
I’ve messaged the CFMO, the form has too many areas of concern. Not sure if the formatting issue for reading the "answers’ is their problem or HQAC.
Personally , if I was a sqn cdr, I would have serious reservations about the legality of the statement that requires counter-signature…
[quote=“MikeJenvey” post=20601]
Personally , if I was a sqn cdr, I would have serious reservations about the legality of the statement that requires counter-signature…[/quote]
Countersigned is/was probably the wrong word if you were referring to my last. 
[quote=“steve679” post=20559]i’ve nothing much to add to the repeated comments on the accuracy of the TG forms (we’ve had a known case where it was a blatant lie given Cadet illness we’d experienced first hand) and agree a new form isnt going to change a parents honesty but i will share the following seen posted on FB by a friend in N Ireland who had a mini-rant indicating it is now very much the end of flying for him
the easy solution which was mentioned in reply was to move to Tutors to NI (Aldergrove still open?) every so often to fly the NI Cadets but who can see that happening?![/quote]
You’ve got the wrong end of the stick. If the cadet has one of the long term conditions mentioned on Av Med Form 1, then raise an F6424 and get the GP and CFMO to sort it out. Provided that there’s no deterioration in condition, that medical is valid for the next 2 years and would need to be produced with the Av Med Form 1, but rather than send it WHQ for archiving, the F6424 is retained by the sqn. Carry out a relatively simple housekeeping exercise and find out well in advance which cadets will require clearance and the problem you describe above is avoided.
Pretty much everything anyone needs to know is either on the form or in the re-written ACTOs. If they can’t figure that out, they shouldn’t be doing the job.
If something needs sorting (or example because of a chronic condition/disability), get clearance via F6424 beforehand. Simples. If it’s something acute that can’t be sorted out in time, then sorry, it’s a no go.
Quite, and the entire purpose of this form is to highlight, and then minimise, the potential poo-traps Bloggsy’s parents may not have foreseen.
I don’t understand why people need clearance outside the airline’s normal medical requirements. If they are OK to fly with the majority of carriers, then needing another form from the ATC is pointless overkill. Sounds like some under-employed adminner who’s filed/painted their nails and drunk their umpteenth cuppa, needing to tick a box.[/quote]
Not quite sure what you’re driving at here, but my guess is the WExO wouldn’t want to spring for a plane ticket unless little Bloggsy is fit to fly.
I don’t understand why people need clearance outside the airline’s normal medical requirements. If they are OK to fly with the majority of carriers, then needing another form from the ATC is pointless overkill. Sounds like some under-employed adminner who’s filed/painted their nails and drunk their umpteenth cuppa, needing to tick a box.[/quote]
Not quite sure what you’re driving at here, but my guess is the WExO wouldn’t want to spring for a plane ticket unless little Bloggsy is fit to fly.[/quote]
But if they are fit to fly on a ordinary carrier which has similar restrictions for passengers affected by the condtions on the list, it baffles me why an ATC adminner, needs a form. Lets face it they could be fine to fly and become unfit just before, so the stumping up for a ticket argument holds no water. It comes across as little more than ATC jobsworth syndrome. I took a cadet gliding who was fine all the way up, chatting and excited, who had a case of all exits about ½ an hour after we got there. I phoned her parents and her mum and one of her brothers had the same, that had come on that morning.
Well, if that’s what you’re wondering, then I have a fairly simple answer. I do hope you can keep up.
If something happens to to that cadet then the only person who might be around to help is the same person who has to fly the aircraft. How do you think you would handle a first aid situation while driving down the motorway? It could be 15-20 min before a casualty can be treated.
Nobody on an easyjet flight is going to be asked to abandon the aircraft by parachute and if they are physically unable to open an emergency exit themselves they are moved away from that exit.
Jesus Wept.
Really?? Did I forget to add the “sarcastic face” to my original post? 
I have had a detailed back from RAF CAM. Basically, their input was medical only, rather than anything else related to other risk assessment factors or form format.
Here is a small extract from the reply:
[quote]In part, the new process tries to mitigate two known risks:
- To make it as likely as possible that parents declare relevant illness
- To make it clear that cadet squadrons also declare known illness before air experience flights. [/quote]
From the second item, I read into that that there have been own goal(s) somewhere??
In short, the spreadsheet is designed to signpost individuals into one of three groups - safe, unsafe and ground.
The risk is “held” by DDH 22 Gp, so down to them for the processes & associated proposals. I guess that 3FTS are the “holders” of the medical form, so queries, etc, should be sent to them. When I find the contact, I shall do so.
Look, its all much of a muchness. The guidance is on the form. As staff, you will know your cadets and plan accordingly.
We sent ours on a short notice (20 hrs) Merlin AEF, they all filled out the forms and while they were all “no’s”, it was a simple process.
Granted, if they had been some “yes’” it would have been a different proposal. Tho as sqn staff, we would have managed those interested
So, in practical terms, how are you guys actually getting these forms completed? Inviting parents in and working through the form on the screen, emailing them to parents and hope they come back on time…?
Is a printed email conversation with the parent pinned to the form acceptable at the AEF/VGS and OK as an audit trail?
What’s working best for you?
personally, much like the regular TG forms, we have the form available on the website under “downloads”
here parents have been able to print off and complete TG forms as required and send in Johnny and Jane with the correct paperwork.
we’ve not got a flying slot until next month so yet to be “tested” however the forms are on the website, the Cadets have been informed there is a new form to be filled in and our (closed) facebook page which includes some parents has also distributed the instructions on where to find the forms.
i am expecting Cadets to treat these much like a TG form, however rather than bring them on the day the Squadron night immediately preceding the AEF opportunity to be “authorised” (signed) by the OC.
(i am however not the Sqn Flying Officer so will wait to see what happens in reality)
The ACTO is very specific about the completed form requirements; all questions must be answered. I would not expect OC AEF to have to deal with a form with an email chain, it defeats the object. What would the messages say? If it is to amplify an answer, then it could cast doubt on the medical validity.
Yes, logistically, the forms will have to be at the sqn earlier for OC signature; planning for reserves will also have to be the same, no “on the day” replacements if anyone drops out.
The ACTO is very specific about the completed form requirements; all questions must be answered. I would not expect OC AEF to have to deal with a form with an email chain, it defeats the object. What would the messages say? If it is to amplify an answer, then it could cast doubt on the medical validity.
.[/quote]
In some cases (CCF), there is no choice but for an email trail.
No issue there…
I was thinking something along the lines of ’ Dear Sir, Attached is the completed flying form for Cdt J Bloggs. Yours, Mrs K Bloggs.
Print both and pin together. That would allow fulfillment of short-notice opportunities and very late drop-outs to be replaced quite rapidly. Or is a completed form with an email trail replacing the hard signature not good enough for safety / auditing purposes in the Corps?
Not that a <16 cadet could forge a signature or an >16 tell a porky on a form to ensure they go flying, of course… 
Expect a revision to the Med Form in the near future. This may well include a change to the form validity (currently one month), & format alterations so that the guidance for a “negative” answer can be clearly read. A hard copy may be considered to augment the Excel version. Some of the text relating to medical conditions may be improved, e.g. relating to “unstable or brittle condition” = what??
The “ATC Sqn/CCF (RAF) Sect Cdr’s responsibility” aspects are seen as a requirement to check the parental responses (rather than to have an insight into medical conditions).
There may well have been insufficient medical screening in the recent past, which resulted in air safety incidents.
Tayside*** awarded contract for Flying Scholarships:
*** What if Scotland goes independent?? :S
(Did mine, a loooooong time ago - 30 hrs flying - at Southampton - much closer to home on the IOW!)
Make sure your passport is in date!! B)
[quote]Full flying by all VGS at own base locations – Jan 16[/quote] :ohmy:
2FTS.
[quote=“MikeJenvey” post=20917]Tayside*** awarded contract for Flying Scholarships:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-29142985[/quote]
Good news, I’ve known many happy “scholars” who’ve gone on to better things.
Move them south of the border. Carlisle might be remote enough!
20 hrs for me at Manston.