Complicated AT fundraiser question

So, here is one for the ACC collective.

I work with a Multiple Sclerosis charity who asked about the feasibility of taking 2 of their wheelchair users up Snowdon as a fundraiser for the local MS society. Both are MS sufferers but both capable of pushing themselves around (albeit not up Snowdon). We’d be going in July.

I had the idea of the Squadron providing the “pushers” up Snowdon, in the form of our numerous older cadets who have completed DofE Gold and numerous mountain days.

We currently have 3 ML and 3 trainee MLs on the Squadron.

Potential plan would be as follows:

2 x ML and 3 x Trainee supervise the wellbeing and safety of the cadets, event is put on SMS as normal and covered as an AT event. Everything as normal, TG forms, First aid cover etc etc.

1 x ML with seperate indepedent liability cover supervises the wellbeing and safety of the wheelchair users. Agreement in place with the wheelchair users that they are not under MOD indemnity etc etc.

All reach the summit. Wheelchair users taken down to the summit station for a pre-booked train back down the Mountain. Cadets walk off. Back for tea and medals.

Thoughts?

It seems on paper easy enough.
what about the MS sufferers welfare? I know technically it doesn’t get covered by the Corps but if something goes wrong it may not look good in the papers. so you may want to do some training with the cadets and the MS Sufferers to get used to each other etc…

I would involve you wing AT officer and get their input sooner as they will probably have to sign it off.

Also complete the Risk Assessment ASAP, and have someone external to the Sqn review it and try and see where you need to change or get any training identified.

1 thing probably would be manual handling training incase they need to lift a wheelchair if it gets stuck. these can be done online pretty cheaply.

You Can not book the train down. The sale/booking is based on the up and down journeys. If you don’t board the train on the upward journey they sell your seat to anyone available and fill the train regardless!

I’ve had a chat to the booking office - that element is sorted, provided we are at the station for the time we book. It’s an exception to the norm, but given its for charity they were keen to help.

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Good advice - thanks.

Currently working on an RA, will be having a chat with the WATTO presently.

My concern would be what happens if something goes wrong - some tech problem, weather or incident stops the trains for example.

Are you and the staff and cadets physically able to bring the wheelchair users all the way down the mountain having taken them all the way up?

Is the ACO a bit part player in this or, if it goes wrong, is it the ACO’s problem?

It would take very little friction to develop on the day for you to find yourself standing at the top with a team of physically exhausted cadets and staff, and being responsible for a couple of wheelchair users who have no way of getting down the mountain. You would be in very deep situational poo on the day, and you’d be in the newspapers the next day,and not in a nice way.

It’s a great idea, and it’s all credit to you and your team that you want to do it and probably could do it - but i wouldn’t touch it with a 60ft burning stick.

(Winter ML).

something else to consider who is carrying the kit??
ie… rucksack with waterproofs, food, water etc

your 2 MS sufferers ( we need a better term) are in wheelchairs so are they getting some bag attached with their kit to the wheelchair?
you cadets are pushing so are they pushing the wheelchairs with people and kit in them AND carrying their own kit?

I would be maybe thinking of getting other cadets (not pushers) to carry the kit.
that way when you change pusher they are not carrying or pushing any load and rest a bit.

Good points.
I would simply add that you need a third and forth teams to your planning.

3rd - Sherpa team. Simply carrying all the extra kit.
4th - back up team. So that you can sub people out even at the last minute.

Also. Consider supplies prepositioned the day before and sent up to the peak via train in the morning. Extra water etc.

I also admire your ideals, but again would steer well clear as the possible negatives outway any possible gains.

Finally.
At the end of every statement you make whilst planning put the line “its in our remit” and see if it still sounds sensible.

Hi all,

Good advice.

The team of cadets are mostly 17-19yr olds who have completed DofE Gold and numerous other mountain days. A large group of them recently completed a 45km cycle, 20km run and 2000m climb on an indoor wall with little issue - the kind of fitness I can only dream of!

Regards the train - we’d have to proceed on the basis that we’d be bringing the chairs back down and the train is a bonus. We are going to have a local hill day at the Roaches near us to see how we get on moving a chair over semi broken ground - which will give us an indication whether it’s a go’er or not.

RE: Comfort and welfare of the wheelchair users - they would have their carers with them to support, but I take the point that it may well be an issue if something changes on the day.

I’m currently engaging with Llanberis MRT to see what they think, since if the worst happened they’d be the ones involved.

Thanks for all the input troops.

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Route choice is likely key for this one, guessing you would go the miners route so most of the pushing can be done on the long path?

Mountain Rescue can get a land rover most of the way up that if needed as well for extraction.

Miners track was the plan, I know there is a few steps higher up that may need some careful negotiation, but generally it’s the best option. Then drop down to the summit station for the train, then back down the miners track.

Or a Vauxhall Frontera if history is anything to go by (although not down again).

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Put it out there as a general opportunity not cadet related on the MS group’s headed paperwork. Something like “we (the MS group) are looking to do a fundraiser and are looking for people (put in a lower age, say 18) to help with pushing wheelchair bound MS sufferers up Snowdon. If you are willing to assist with this venture, for more information please contact … .” Send it to a couple of other groups to remove bias. Even if it’s just ATC bods, it’s not been exclusively been advertised to the ATC.

Get someone else in the group to write and sign the letter and while you personally will have the bias of involvement, it’s divorced from the squadron and ATC, and becomes a private activity. It also gets around the pitfall of it not being on the list of groups the ATC can assist.

Who knows it might inspire them to get more involved with the MS group. One of my wife’s friends has relapsing and remitting MS and I’ve run a couple of quiz nights for the group she’s part of.

I think trying to do it as an ATC activity opens all manner of ATC founded problems, plus any staff have an ATC liability for the cadets. Personally I would be completely distancing this from the ATC officially.
We’ve put things up from local groups looking for help and left it at that, which has resulted in some going along.

…And then not have any of the publicity benefits.

Or you could just, you know, actually do it properly?

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You can still get the publicity and who says it’s not being done properly, if it was cadets and staff doing it independently. The Air Cadets are not the only organisation to do things.