If they’re not doing any ‘regulated activity’ then it would be fine. So keep them as cadets, not staff cadets. No extra powers or responsibilities etc. Then it should be fine.
I think…
ACP 20 has been updated again to, among other changes, give “further refinement of O18 policy”.
On first look only related change I can see is the addition of this line (my bold):
Cadets and Staff Cadets will be able to apply to become a CFAV subject to being 18 years of age and having completed post-16 education. The application should be encouraged as CI. By exception, a Wg Board may agree that an applicant is of such an exceptional standard that they could be consider for either SNCO or officer.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t recall any mention of a Wing Board being required before a CFC/SNCO application is even considered in any previous IBN/town halls/FAQ etc. Of course it has always been part of the application itself.
Edit: or does it mean the assesment of “exceptional standards” takes place during the normal Wg board, but there will be closer scruity of suitability if the applicant is 18/19
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Maybe I just haven’t read ACP 20 recently enough, as it’s not in yellow highlights, but it looks like the need for pre-CIC waivers has been removed for internal applicants (former CIs, staff cadets etc). If nothing else that seems like a smart move.
Why would you encourage your 18 year olds to spent time out of uniform when you’ve already agreed they’re suitable to become staff rather than remain a staff cadet?
I could understand placing an extra hurdle in the way of them going straight to a commission if you still saved that for sqn leadership and strategic planning roles, but if you can’t churn a cadet out of the system and have them be suitable for immediate re-muster as a SNCO (RAFAC) then they shouldn’t be staff.
Am I missing something?
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Yes - it allows them to get into the way of things as Staff, explore more in depth which way they actually want to go if they go into uniform and not necessarily what the wing/Sqn wants them to go, or alternatively pushing them nco because either its quicker, or because it seems more natural because there isn’t officer ranks amongst the cadets. It also doesn’t beholden them to minimum times on Sqn, so if they want to go and have a night out doing all the stuff you do at uni, or first year in work crack on and don’t feel guilty about your cadet stuff,
Now I am of the belief the army system works well for this with their PI but that’s a whole different scheme 
There are plenty of threads on here about CIs and the fact that you can basically do anything a uniformed staff member can do (so I also wont dive there lol) so I can see the purpose, even if its not quite how I would of done it
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Yep - some cadets are not suitable to go straight into SNCO - they like the idea of being one but lack the maturity or experience to do so - sometimes the need that 6-month psychological break between uniform as a cadet & uniform as staff even if they are 20.
As always though we should tailor it to the skills & ability & capacity of the individual not have a blanket policy (so default to CI but push for SnCo where there is a case make sense)
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Which undersells the value of our CI’s. Now my views on abolishing CI are well documented on the forum, however the work that they do shouldn’t be understated in this way. The same with Cadet SNCO:s. I’ve had both fulfilling the Training Officer and Adjutant roles over the years and effectively as Deputy OC.
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a consequence no one at HQAC or indeed the soon to be O18 might consider* is in doing so, on the expectation they may wait until 20 to becoming uniformed CFAV, is they’ll loose two years towards a CFM.
whereas a FS who sticks around as a Cadet, and then at 19y6m applies for uniform position in anticipation of being appointed once turning 20 will be able to claim the years 18-19 and 19-20.
whereas the “encouraged CI” at 18 can only claim it from their uniformed CFAV time
I know we’re not in it for the medals (although some/any form of recognition of what we do is always welcome) it will mean there will be fewer CFMs worn by those aged 30/31
*not that i feel it should influence a decision either way on what a soon to be O18 does, just simply a consequence of the policy
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Equally, how many will want to return to uniform, once they’ve had the option of rocking up in jeans and hoodies
Was certainly a painful moment for me, back to the ironing board…
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I agree with you on the ACF PI system idea, although it would need another change for me I still don’t think they have gone far enough. Pull CWO app age to 15.5 for appointment from 16. At the age of 18 in the ATC world scrap “staff cadet” and give the person 2 options, CI (non-uniform), Or PI (Probationary instructor) if you go “PI” you “serve” for 24 months at PI doing the different quals alongside the combined course at Cranwell and a structured training package before making a decision after talks with either OC or Wing Staff as to if you go RAFAC NCO or Officer and referral to boards as needed. Then at 20 be appointed as either Sgt or Plt Off RAFAC. Or with CI a similar idea with localised training and less commitment
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Still adding extra steps. PI at 18, promotion to Sgt on completion of training (& passing boards as for current CFAV).
The one tweak I’d make is a new PI has to have finished their compulsory schooling.
I’d also advocate the same system for ex cadets and new people. Maybe ex
Cadets can skip some parts of the training but why limit CFAV to 20 when the other CFs don’t?
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As a 17 year old who’s already weighed up his options (CFC/NCO/CI/ FO), and started the process with pusc.
Why so many back pedals? there are a lot of staff cadets and nearly staff cadets in my wing who are trying to start the transition process but keep getting shocked with new policy changes
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Welcome to the world of HQAC policy
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The wording of the current policy suggests this is the case for cadets becoming CFAV at 18.
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No offence to our staff cadets/approaching 18 yr olds who want to cross the Rubicon to staff!!
But…
Would love to see the stats on those joining straight from Cadet service on how long they last and how much they achieve. I know there will always be outliers but how many go from a focus that may be just education/cadets to discovering work, wine, women and song and find their priorities have shifted.
Is the cost/work to move them over balanced by the service and value we get from them?
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I find they tend to be our busiest members of staff who throw themselves in the deep end, unfortunately I also find that they are the staff who end up the most burnt out.
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It’s quite the opposite I’d suggest. Cadets who go straight into CFAV are doing a huge amount and we couldn’t deliver without them. I can think of many, many ex-cadets who went straight into CFAV roles and are currently very active CFAV.
From Sgts to WOs and Plt Offs to Wg Cdrs, including Sqn OCs and Wing staff, so it’s not just for a couple of years.
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Of all the CFAV I know that are under 40, the vast majority are ex cadets. They also seem to make up a large proportion of the staff that are out doing stuff and running things. Keeping cadets on as CFAV is critical to the survival of this organisation. As is proper retention for all staff.
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That’s what I ended up doing to myself. Took the pandemic to make me re-evaluate how much time I was dedicating to cadets.
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