Beards


#141

Negative. I have always maintained that cadets can do what they like.


#142

The ones I saw in the media had BA sets under their kit. I have a friend who was intimately involved as a responder, very very scary time and so much witheld about the situation.


#143

It’s just their job. Pays the mortgage. Can’t sit and mope about it can they. It’s quite literally what they get paid for…


#144

I am.


#145

Ah, fair one. I stand corrected.


#146

So am I.

It would grease the wheels of acceptance to then allow then in RAFAC, since there seems to be an expectation that we play by their rules, but mostly because I cannot see why a standard that has been applied within the RN should not be adopted tri-service.


#147

Trainsets I would imagine is why, that and lack of common sense.
It makes sense as said to have relaxed standards with the expectation that as and when required, things go up a notch.
A problem I can seen for cadet forces and the requirement to be on parades and inspections all the time, there would be little scope for relaxation.
Also how would the moustachoed, pace stick wielding pie eaters cope. They in recent years have been increasingly tiresome as common sense has left the building and all about the ‘rules’ and scrutinising / interpreting them to death.


#148

Relaxed standards only work on individuals or teams of self motivated and self disciplined people.
Otherwise, people take the Mickey and standards slip. Given an inch they take a mile.

The majority of Private bloggs in the Royal messtin repair Regiment arent going to be said disciplined and motivated people.


#149

Correct me if i’m wrong, but don’t people in the RN who want to grow a beard have to get it ‘approved’?


#150

They do. They ask permission and then have 14 days to grow it, before being inspected to see if it is approved.
It has to be a “full set” ie Beard and Moustache not some Amish style or goatee.
If it passes inspection then you are allowed to keep it, it must be well kept.


#151

Having worked with the Dutch and German military, both of whom permit the growing of beards, I’ve always considered that beards and uniform together looks gash and ill-disciplined.

Some years ago during the Arnhem March, I saw some Danish Home Guard in uniform taking part and there was an array of beards, berets pushed to the back of the head, cigarettes in the corner of the mouth and general slackness all round.

I kid you not - there were female HG pushing kids in pushchairs which were decked out in the HG uniform flecktarn-style material.

Back to beards. If they were to be allowed, I’m sure there would be a number of individuals all claiming to have a right to different styles and going full snowflake if someone tried to get a grip of them. Some might want a neat set, some who want to push the boundaries might opt for the Capn Jack Sparrow look.

Where might beards lead to? The Danish Home Guard type of approach?

I’m firmly on the side of the current dress regs. No beards.

[Edited to add: two exceptions - religious beliefs and in-theatre Ops].


#152

Taking Daws’ comment, I worked in that environment and seen the dress requirements change as suggested.
We don’t work any differently, we can’t, or someone will be over you like chicken pox. We work with the same levels of professionalism as when I started. The methods have changed but the requirements of the output hasn’t.
The suggestion seems to be that a day to day relaxation in the military will make people do things shoddily, but I doubt this. As has been mentioned when in theatre things relax, but people are no less professional. The only basis for the regulations around appearance is to give certain roles something to do.


#153

Things relax because there is a more important thing to worry about.

And it only relaxes for lads on the FOBs due to lack of running water or resources.

There’s numerous examples of lads getting back to Main camps and being promptly jumped on by some fat RAF WO for not shaving.

It might work in civvie street where the most dangerous thing you handle is a stapler. But I have seen some horrendous creatures of the deep in the forces, normally Pongo’s, but you RAF types aren’t angels, who lacked any kind of sense of hygiene or discipline.

In small, close knit teams that work together and are highly motivated and disciplined it can work.

It’s the Military it’s not hard. You keep your boots clean, you shave and do as your told. Job done.


#154

By no stretch of the imagination am I an RAF type. While I and other may have had some loose tenuous association to the RAF, that has been removed. The RAF keep hold of the ATC for ceremonial purposes only now, where it can’t or can’t be bothered.
That said there are a number of staff in the ATC, who live, eat and breath the RAF.


#155

That sounds like a problem of general gashness, rather than a purely beard issue.

People in the forces (RAF and Army) think that beards look odd because they’re used to it, just like you’d think that a long-sleeved wedgwood shirt without a tie would look odd. From a naval perspective, beards look fine if the rest of the uniform is up to scratch.


#156

If its good enough for the queens grand son to wear a full set in uniform it should be good enough for the rest of us.


#157

He’s probably got permission from the head of the management.


#158

He doesn’t need permission from anyone - he’s out, they can’t sack him, it’s just fancy dress and he can wear what he likes.

His old boy gets away with it, so why not him?