Banner Manufacturer Recommendations?

I’m looking to replace the old squadron banner, so would like some recommendations for manufacturers. There were several threads on this on the old forum, but I now can’t find them, despite repeated searches.

Thanks.

Hmm, I can’t find them either, sorry GOM!

Cheers Pep,

Aside from Ripoff Direct, I’ve found two companies - Porters and Netwon-Newton - who make a very similar product and very reasonably priced. However, the scroll with the squadron name is depicted as a straight scroll, rather than curved, which seems rather odd to me (I’ve always seen curved ‘rocker’ scrolls on squadron banners).

Newton Flags are the company I’ve often heard banded around as the place to go! I think Cadet Direct sell Newton Flags’ products!

Nice to see you back GOM!

I never left. Everyone else did! I was wondering what I’d said… :oops:

It certainly does seem that Ripoff Direct are just a middle-man for NN.

I wonder if NN or Porters would do a curved scroll… worth asking.

Does anyone happen to have a link to the regulations for Squadron Banner design? I’ve seen so many variations that I can’t recall what the regulation design looks like! My old squadron still has the banner originally issued to is by the ATC in the 1960s (we didn’t have to buy them then) - there is no scroll at all, but the squadron title is simply applied directly onto the blue ground, curved around the bottom of the crest.

[quote=“GOM” post=4912]I never left. Everyone else did! I was wondering what I’d said… :oops:

It certainly does seem that Ripoff Direct are just a middle-man for NN.

I wonder if NN or Porters would do a curved scroll… worth asking.

Does anyone happen to have a link to the regulations for Squadron Banner design? I’ve seen so many variations that I can’t recall what the regulation design looks like! My old squadron still has the banner originally issued to is by the ATC in the 1960s (we didn’t have to buy them then) - there is no scroll at all, but the squadron title is simply applied directly onto the blue ground, curved around the bottom of the crest.[/quote]

I think mine is the same (will check later)

I hear NN do good work but they are pricey. My ACF unit has two banners, a detachment banner from Cadet Kit Shop (county policy) and a union banner from Flying Colours Flagmakers. The quality on both is good to be honest.

I emailed Newton a few years back, because I didn’t like the straight scroll on the Cadet Direct banners. (Which I think they get from the same place as the shop at Frimley Park.) Newton said they can do the rounded scrolls if that’s what you’re after. (which I prefer as it looks more like every other crest in the ATC.) I don’t remember their quote, and I’ve deleted the emails from back then.

Thanks Baldrick.

[quote=“Leeroy” post=4908]

Nice to see you back GOM![/quote]

You absence was noted, excellent that you’re back on the forum! We had a brand-new banner kindly donated recently, I’ll make enquiries to confirm the source- if I had to make a prediction, it’ll have been ‘Direct’.

wilf_san

I’m pretty sure Incubus had a new one made up recently?

Or at least I remember him asking on the old forum! :?

[quote=“wilf_san” post=4936]

You absence was noted,
wilf_san[/quote]

Was this ‘noting’ along the lines of “Thank God GOM hasn’t found us”?

Not in the least, GOM, it was your seasoned opinion and dry humour, I kid you not. Great to see you back.

Re this point regarding scrolled versus straight squadron markings on banners: firstly, can anyone confirm what the style was on the original ADCC banners, as that would be a valid starting point. Secondly (although they may just be scroll-curved as well), the style for ATC banners shouldn’t necessarily have followed the fashion of regular RAF squadron colours. As well as the territorial/ county affiliations enjoyed by current ATC squadrons, back in the founding days of the Corps, I’d’ve expected the TAFAs (the early ancestors of RFCA) to provide banners which were the same general pattern as brokered for all other locally-raised army and air force volunteer formations. That’s a strong gut feeling, but could be easily confirmed.

And on gut instincts: I could be totally wrong, but the straight unscrolled title just looks…odd. Of course, an actual banner or colour is rarely like that, unless there’s a stiff breeze, or when in altar/drum-head drape mode, so even a straight cloth title would appear curved most of the time.

What style of detachment titles do the Additional Cadet Force have on their banners?

wilf_san

I was wrong re my old squadron banner - Having looked at a photo of it, the text is actually applied (without any scroll) in a straight, horizontal line. Funny how memory plays tricks. That said, my current (water-damaged) squadron banner definitely has a curved ‘rocker’ scroll.

Newton-Newton have now sent me an example photo of one they did with a curved scroll (just the one!), which looks lovely, so I’ll go for that. The quality looks good, the price is good and they have lots of happy customers in the ATC, so they’ll do for me.

Porter’s are about £150 cheaper, but the font used for the text doesn’t look as good and I’ve not seen any testimonials from ATC squadrons, so I think I’ll opt for the safer option, even though it’s a bit more expensive.

Re the regs - there is definitely a set of regulations governing the design, buried somewhere in ACPs, but I haven’t found it yet. I’m guessing it’s in AP 1919, so I’ll have a look when I go to squadron tonight. I seem to remember that you can also have the squadron crest displayed in the canton of the squadron banner, so I’m going to play with ms paint to see how that looks (once I’ve checked the regs).

The wording you’re looking for used to be contained in ACP 19.
It is currently repeated in ACTO 120 as part of the regulations for the Banner Drill Competition.

[quote]
3. Existing Squadron Banners may continue to be used until they wear out, but all new or replacement Banners are to:

a. Be of RAF blue heavy silk or artificial silk.

b. Be not larger than 2’6” on the pike and 3’6” in breadth.

c. Bear the ATC badge in a central position with any local authority badge, RAFA badge or device in a corner position. No other badge or device is to be included in the design. The Sqn name and number may be included in the design above or below the ATC badge.

d. Be carried on a pike no longer than 7’ in length. [/quote]

Something which is not covered but I encounter almost invariably is that the tassles, as supplied, are too long.
The length should ideally be adjusted so that the knots fall at the bottom of the shortest edge of the Banner with the pike vertical (i.e. 2’6" for the normal size).

This should allow them to be neatly wrapped 3 times around the Banner when it’s cased. Anyone who’s seen the “RAF Colour and Standard Drills” DVD and then attempted to do the same with their Banner will likely have found that once they’ve wrapped 3 times, they’ve still got a foot or more cord dangling around.

Today’s tid bit:
“RAF Blue” does in fact have a definitve reference as well. It’s Pantone colour 549C.

One of the Squadrons in my Wing opted to buy one of those nasty, cheap, printed nylon Banners. It was a horrible bright, blue; not the nice, pale azure tone that it should be. It really does stick out like a sore thumb at the Wing Parade.
Definitely worth paying a little more for a quality product when it comes to ceremonial if you ask me.

I’ve not had a Banner from Newton-Newton but I’ve bought parts from them in the past. Good to deal with.

Cheers, that’s suitably vague. I’m sure I’ve read something more specific though, including the bit about allowing a squadron crest in the canton - perhaps it was the RAFA crest mentioned that I was thinking of?

I agree - no point in buying crap. There’s a banner like that in our wing as well. :ohmy:

I recommend Newton Newton as previously mentioned. We replaced ours about 8 years ago now with a NN and it is great quality and solid. It’s worth the price I think.

Hello
we got our banner from Cadets uk. Banner ( embroidered both sides , flag pole and flag and pole carry bag for £345 and it was great quality

I would always go to Newton and Newton.
Without question.

Our current banner was purchased from Newton Newton 11 years ago, is used regularly and still looks like new - we went for the darker blue. Fitted to an even older pike that I am about to ask my committee to replace.