So looks like at AT PTS is on a cards now! There’s TORs for someone to help create it.
Well that’s AT now killed!
I would have thought AT would have been too varied to try & fit into a PTS mould.
although you could argue it already has it in the form of Duke of Edinburgh
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Can we stop pigeonholing everything into a syllabus, please?! Especially if they don’t even give cadets recognition in the form of a badge?!
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Pigeonholing Into a PTS syllabus
I think PTS has had its day & now needs to be retired.
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Problem is that seniors won’t except training unless it fits one of the PTS areas, removing all the fun of an event.
Fought for an activity to take place, because its the way we’ve done in the past. Got told to change to meet PTS requirements.
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Paid staff or volunteer staff?
when speaking to paid staff they tend work along the principles that it doesn’t stop you delivering things outside the PTS it just means you don’t get a badge for it.
Or any money for it
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PTS for AT is a terrible idea. Progression in AT can be about developing skills, overcoming personal limits or just doing more. The progression varies from person to person and trying to link this to badges isn’t helpful in encouraging participation.
If there’s a set standard to achieve for climbing for example, some cadets might find that really simple and fly up the wall, others might be terrified and take the whole session to build up to getting 5m off the ground. Who has actually developed more or achieved more in that session? Issuing a badge, based on some made up standard, doesn’t recognise their achievement.
We’ve seen PTS turn many activities into tick boxes for badge collectors. I hate that AT could be heading the same way.
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Completely agree. AT is a great way to get cadets out of their comfort zone and build confidence in a challenging but safe environment. The impact of this cannot be measured through generalised tick boxes.
Not everything we do has to have a badge or onwards progression to it - sometimes we should be able to do something because it is fun and a challenge for the cadets. If we want to build resilient and confident young people, we need to accept that a generalised training syllabus isn’t going to work for everyone or for every activity we offer.
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Drill PTS will have no badges
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It can also be a pain because if everything is in levels, there’s strict progression.
The more a unit has to deliver several tiers of content (like classifications), the more it stretches us.
Whereas the more of it that can be taught as a rolling subject (perhaps on a two-year cycle), with all cadets doing it together regardless of experience (bronze first aid content works well for this as a whole-squadron activity), it’s so much easier to deliver.
And bronze first aid should really be maintained as a skill, not taught once and forgotten. So it’s perfect for doing for everyone, even if broken down into small chunks and not earning a badge.
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No badges is good. Will there be defined Blue/Bronze etc levels? Defining progression for an activity is sensible and enables a consistent national syllabus e.g. static drill, marching, banner, squad ic, instructor. Pigeon-holing this into Blue, Bronze etc is where it feels artificial and often not helpful to encouraging activity.
Yep.
And it’s aligned for Cadet and CFAV development.
I get the place for PTS, I think it should be reserved for the core activities to be honest to drive development and progression in our core experience but everything outside that sphere I’m not convinced it has a place. But that’s just my opinion
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I’d agree. It skews focus away from learning and trying new things for their own sake towards only doing it when you get a badge.
Motivators are good, but not when it sparks a negative response to a lack of badge.
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Just want to add that I agree with what most people are saying already. I really don’t see a PTS style system working for AT, not in the current blue, bronze, silver and gold system anyway.
There are many progressive systems already within AT. In climbing you have NICAS and NIBAS. On the water you have the Paddle Awards. In navigation/walking you have NNAS. etc
These systems already exist, but honestly you don’t see them given out much. I’d suggest that’s because when we do AT we’re normally just delivering an experience, rather than focusing on progression as such. Mostly due to resource constraints.
But then those young people who really do want to progress can look at the many coach and leader options.
I really don’t think trying to shoehorn what already exists into a blue, bronze etc system will be a good idea. Especially as there is such a bredth to what we can deliver. And as others have rightly pointed out, AT can and generally is very personal in terms of achievement. There’s no set goal amongst a group. I’ve taken 12 cadets climbing where we have 1 person struggling to get off the ground and another who’s completely independent and their challenge is trying to flash a 6b+. They’re both achieving.
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I got into kayaking as a kid because I did it ONCE on a Cub camp.
That was it. I then went on to do it constantly, gaining instructor quals and playing canoe polo and competing all over the place in K1 slalom.
Sometimes delivering an experience, perhaps even by utilising an external specialist, is enough.
I’ll look to do more with archery because it’s a thing we can easily provide locally and perhaps run alongside the air rifle range (and uses some similar principles). But we need to be careful about stretching too thinly and being all things to all people.
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Can we push back against this in any way? And would this mean, if God forbid it is implemented, ALL AT has to be delivered under the auspices of the syllabus?!
Appreciate the how is still being looked at, but I’m wondering how a PTS for such a broad range of activities could be possible. Would each activity within AT have its own PTS?
I suppose that Gold would end up being the NGB qualification, which cadets could only partially use unless they transferred to CFAV. What would the other levels be? Blue: walk X hours without getting catastrophically lost?
That’s the officers in trouble
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Darn, beaten to it! 
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