Adult / Cadet ratios

A quick question. I asked a female Cadet to have a quick chat with me and another adult, both of us male, to discuss there progress for promotion. She refused to enter the room stating it was against regulations. I’m a little perplexed as I believe I had this covered seeing as there were 2 adults in the room together with her.

I’ve looked through ACP5 and can see no clarification. Anyone come across the same or know a definitive answer.

Nothing I’ve ever either seen nor heard of.

It’s advised to have at least three people in a room if any cadets are present (ie 3 cadets, 2 cadets and a CFAV or 1 cadet and 2 CFAVs). No need for a specific gender mix.

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Same here and there’s nothing about the scenario that suggests another cadet of staff member of the cadet’s choosing would need to be a consideration.

Although not written down. Its always good practice to ensure any third party is of the gender of the cadet you are talking to.

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Is it?

If the two people relevant to the discussion are male and the cadet is female, needlessly adding another staff body could be over intimidating and seem heavy handed (although I have done it). And it might not be appropriate to have another cadet present (discussing promotion prospects would fit). And unless it’s heavily disciplinary there’s no need to bother a parent.

There is obviously something else going on if she was distressed. Speak to your OC - or if you are your OC flag it up with the WExO.

Perhaps ask her who told her this?

It is amazing how much time we waste having to prove negatives to staff who read something ‘somewhere’ that means we can’t do X.

I once was asked to prove there wasn’t a regulation against having WiFi on squadron. Because the Adj thought he had read it somewhere.

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Just to say, I’m not surprised you didn’t find anything in ACP 5 if that’s indeed where you looked :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

ACP 4 is the one, although I suppose you could write a risk assessment for it…

I agree that there could be something else going on, but would suggest avoiding hysterics at this stage. “I once heard somebody say…” is up there with OC’s discretion.

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They way i worded it was a bit pants i was refering to the other member of staff…not necessairly adding another member of staff

But if the two people responsible for whatever the conversation topic is are both male, and they both need to make to make an independent judgement…

Perfect world, nothing wrong with one of each - especially if that’s what makes you feel comfortable as a CFAV, but not always possible or necessarily relevant.

I’d be interested to hear if this cadet still doesn’t want to be in a (decent sized - no cupboards please) room with two male staff after being told there’s no regulation against it.

When I first joined as a CI I was told not to mingle with cadets unless there was another staff member within eye-shot. It’s stuck with me ever since, now if I’m in a room and cadets walk in the room you will often see me walk out and stand in the hall way or go in the office pretending “ooh I need to get a pen to make pretend notes” male or female cadets if they need measuring for uniform I get a nco of the same gender to measure and stay with me. I have my own kids in the Sqn and treat them like any other cadet on Sqn.

You never know who’s a [Removed] in this day and age so can understand why there are rules around cadets etc…back in my day we’d get clipped round the ear in jest or picked up by staff and chucked in a lake if we didn’t jump…none of that now.

Id like to think we don’t have any dodgy staff in our wing, or throughout the cadet organisation for that matter but who knows?

I saw this and phoned a mate who is a teacher and asked if they just talk to kids one to one and she said all the time, male or female. She said nothing would happen if they had to find another member of staff to just stand there. They said a lot of pupils want to talk about test results, problems they are having with the subject, problems with other kids in the classes and classes they are in, trying to get them changed, which can be problematic if they bring a mate, they are told to come back or see them during the day. She said if they get really contentious they are referred to the HOD and told they can get mum / dad in as well.

They said if it’s a safeguarding issue their process is refer direct to pastoral leads, the kids know this, so the ordinary teachers don’t get very many kids coming to them, they go direct to pastoral leads or one of the safeguarding team. Even in form classes they don’t really get very much involved in safeguarding. If they become aware of a kid who they think is having problems, they just refer to pastoral as they may well be aware of problems. If not, she said pastoral view them in classes and if they don’t seem normal, they try to speak to them in casually in the playground or ask them to come and see them. Which are one to one.

I doubt this cadet or any cadet is able to get what they seem to be asking for at the squadron at school.

We should be taking our practice from education and not try and evoke practices that are largely impractical?

I don’t mingle with cadets much on parade nights as they seem to be more on guard when in uniform. When doing something less formal, they seem more willing to talk.


Do you have any kind of history with this cadet that would lead her to ask for another cadet to back her up? Is it possible that she was advised by an NCO not to be alone with staff?

From what I found out, this cadet wouldn’t have it in school, where lets face it they are more likely to have a history with teachers and not get it.

The line between using good sense and judgement and being utterly paranoid seems to be blurred a lot!

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I’m not entirely sure what she would hope to achieve by having a mate present, other than avoiding an honest appraisal of her poor chance of immediate promotion.