Assuming we may get £1.5m, what would you spend it on, to get the best return?
I would like to see a proportion go towards publicity.
Too often referred to as the “best kept secret” the ATC/ACO isn’t a high street name for some.
Living in a sleepy home counties village I didn’t hear about the local ATC Sqn, 3 miles from my front door until they was a big push on recruitment and three schoolmates “bullied” me into turning up.
Arguably a problem with that Squadron’s interaction with the local community and catchment area but everyone says it so my case can’t be unique.
A proportion on sorting out for good the Classification examples.
With this money ditch Ultimedia’s failed “ultilearn” concept and go down the route of a dedicated platform for what we want and need
^^note i say publicity not necessarily recruitment.
if we have a name/organisation which is well known then the recruitment will come…ask Mr/Mrs Joe/Jo Bloggs on the street name a youth group and how many would mention Cadet forces…and where abouts would that sit below the Scouts??
Publicity as opposed to recruitment as Steve suggests and new email system.
The publicity materials could be in the form of squadron specific A3 or A4 posters, done at Cranwell, rather than the corporate things.
An email system that is fit for the 21st century, with a decent personal allowance, something like 2GB. I’ve had my business account with 2.5GB since the mid-90s and still more than two-thirds empty. If we could shake loose from the shackles imposed by the MoD on attachments, it would be good.
Or just get staff to learn how to use Sharepoint properly!
If wing HQs and staff uploaded docs to sharepoint as they’re supposed to IAW JSP101 then 40mb would be fine. The average text email is well under 100kb, so 40mb gives you over 400 emails worth.
Smashing UNLESS the document name and or filename and or location is changed. Then a link is useless.
The other major issue I have is multiple logins. IF I’m logged in for email, SMS or Sharepoint, I should be logged in for all of it. When I login at work I am logged in for everything on the company intranet, Sharepoint, BADER IMO constitute the ‘company intranet’ and as such I should not have to login again to use anything else. Even if I work from home or anywhere and login in using my VPN, I have full access to all work systems, packages and files. There is probably some noncy MoD reason why we have to have multiple logins, but does nothing for making it usable/user friendly. If how we have to do things is how people in the MoD have to work, I’m only thankful I don’t work for the MoD, it would drive me insane.
So a proper email system is what many know and this should be where the investment happens.
Problems with things moving can be mitigated by:
(a) Having a proper system on Sharepoint so that things don’t need to be moved or re-named in the first place#
(b) Giving things sensible file names so that they can be searched for.
I do agree with you on the logins - I don’t think it’s mostly security, simply the fact that we use four different systems (although I’m surprised that email and Sharepoint can’t be logged into simultaneously, as they’re both Microsoft products).
SMS does require additional login info for some however, so security probably does play a small part.
In an ideal world, every staff member would have a unique log on - logging them on to SMS, Exchange (mail), Sharepoint and Ultilearn with one entry - thus their own password and the possibility of logging who’s been using the email and Sharepoint sites.
Change the record lads. You’re becoming a bit of a bore.
This thread is about theoretical budget funding, not the intricacies of Bader.
Apart from the b******s that IT in the ATC has become and to answer POP
£1,500,000/940Sqns= £1660 per Sqn.
Wing and regions do not need this gear as they only work 9-5 Mon Fri. It needs to go to the coal face. £1600 should be enough to get some or all of the following
Recruitment
1 X Marquee with sqn branding etc for events outdoor or large indoor areanas
2 X popups with activities contact details and parade times for said sqn.
ACO branded gissits for events as long as it is cheap and plentyful.
Decent quality recruitment literature with up to date local information. I recently found on my sqn some recruitment flyers that stated we had 7 regions. Info should be local to unit and not region and up to date. sqns in the past horded this stuff because there was not a plentyful supply.
Large banners to put out at events such to tell Joe public who we are and how to join. How many times have you been out in No 3 uniform or adv trg gear and people have no idea who we are what we do or how to join.
Recruitment paraphernalia needs to be bottom up and not top down as in the past. To me in South Wales having large expencive equipment such as the Climbing or ace platform Based in Cosford is no good to me especially if I have to go and fetch it.
For recrutment things need to be atractive and relevent to the local sqn, the flyers and gissits need to be plentyful with local information. They need to be kept up to date and the old stuff need to be binned. unles it has the current info on it it just look un professional.
[quote=“the silverback” post=16581]Apart from the b******s that IT in the ATC has become and to answer POP
£1,500,000/940Sqns= £1660 per Sqn.
Wing and regions do not need this gear as they only work 9-5 Mon Fri. It needs to go to the coal face. £1600 should be enough to get some or all of the following
Recruitment
1 X Marquee with sqn branding etc for events outdoor or large indoor areanas
2 X popups with activities contact details and parade times for said sqn.
ACO branded gissits for events as long as it is cheap and plentyful.
Decent quality recruitment literature with up to date local information. I recently found on my sqn some recruitment flyers that stated we had 7 regions. Info should be local to unit and not region and up to date. sqns in the past horded this stuff because there was not a plentyful supply.
Large banners to put out at events such to tell Joe public who we are and how to join. How many times have you been out in No 3 uniform or adv trg gear and people have no idea who we are what we do or how to join.
Recruitment paraphernalia needs to be bottom up and not top down as in the past. To me in South Wales having large expencive equipment such as the Climbing or ace platform Based in Cosford is no good to me especially if I have to go and fetch it.
For recrutment things need to be atractive and relevent to the local sqn, the flyers and gissits need to be plentyful with local information. They need to be kept up to date and the old stuff need to be binned. unles it has the current info on it it just look un professional.[/quote]
That’s the typical attitude most people will have. Try co-ordinating 900 sets of “local” information to go on all this material. Then having limited print runs for 900 different styles which need to be direct posted to units. Try getting those units to respond. Where does a unit store a marquee? My stores is choc full of equipment already! I don’t want a 7" box lying around either. If i want one, i’ll get it from one of our hub Sqns who look after kit for the Sector.
However, £1.5M on a series of equipment to support Sqns is great. Some stuff for straight away issue (pull up banners, display PVC banners yes). Pay for a dedicated recruitment handling centre (they don’t cost that much). They can handle enquiries, post out initial details with contact info for the nearest squadron. Gizzits - yes, but keep it simple. Fancy USB sticks are just a waste of money. We don’t want to splurge the cash in one year - sustainable delivery to see us through 4/5 years. Few paid for radio adverts on the decent stations. Paid for social media advertising on targeted audiences.
[BRB - boss just walked in]
Due to the way other organisations are organised we do have some advantages. If central printing could do the printing (limited cost) royal mail could put a leaflet into every house in the uk ~£200k, and a central manned phone for 3 months another £40K?
I think the scouts will hold an inter-national Jamboree and advertise like made with lots of air time. they probably already have one orgainsed and this money will make it viable.
The money I guess will have to be spent this year, but we would like to make a lasting effect.
Moving Windermere out of a town to a better rural location. Close Llanbdr and combine both activity centers and in new center. Increase the number of cadets to attend, with combined/increased number of center instuctors and a permanent chef, more Adventure. Staff courses all the time like ATF.
£1.6m wont do a lot for flying or glyding, appart from promotiing it. But it needs to work first.
I dont think splitting into unit values would give a big return as it will be lost in dilution and parliment would want to see some ROI.
If a wing had 20-30K and a focused plan to recruit in needed areas would enable hopefully a greater increase, but then why would you not just bolster the best units as the ROI would be better and more sustainable.
If a unit is viable and sustainable why promote it?
A wing led campaign and focused on the viablity of the whole wing could give a lasting effect and a kick start to strugeling units.
Cadet or Staff recruitment? Both. 60:40 to staff:cadets IMHO.
How I would love £1600 to spend on publicity materials that are sqn specific. It would last several years.
Getting posters and flyers printed professionally rather than trying to do them at work or at the sqn, would be great.
Banners advertising us rather than the organisation as a whole, again great.
If you wanted to pay to target social media then you need to target the parent age group 35-45 as our target audience 11-13 year olds aren’t old enough to use it and it wouldn’t be appropriate as a responsible youth organisation to advocate it’s use like that. This would also publicise us to potential staff/helpers, double hit.
If it’s going to be spent centrally then we need general publicity using our much vaunted ambassador (buy him a t-shirt with the usual logos) and not some half cocked staff recruitment campaign.
[quote=“kfd” post=16584]
Moving Windermere out of a town to a better rural location. Close Llanbdr and combine both activity centers and in new center. Increase the number of cadets to attend, with combined/increased number of center instuctors and a permanent chef, more Adventure. Staff courses all the time like ATF. [/quote]
That’s a crap idea in my opinion. You’d be far better off merging the ATC, SCC and ACF centres in a Joint Service Cadet Adventure Training model, delivering courses along the same lines as CCAT as a mix of distributed training and standard civilian NGB courses. All aligned to the JSAT scheme, delivering military quals for those that move into the services and civilian AT qualifications.
[quote=“redowling” post=16586][quote=“kfd” post=16584]
Moving Windermere out of a town to a better rural location. Close Llanbdr and combine both activity centers and in new center. Increase the number of cadets to attend, with combined/increased number of center instuctors and a permanent chef, more Adventure. Staff courses all the time like ATF. [/quote]
That’s a crap idea in my opinion. You’d be far better off merging the ATC, SCC and ACF centres in a Joint Service Cadet Adventure Training model, delivering courses along the same lines as CCAT as a mix of distributed training and standard civilian NGB courses. All aligned to the JSAT scheme, delivering military quals for those that move into the services and civilian AT qualifications.[/quote]
Whole heartedly agree - courses are often undersubscribed and centres under utilised. A Joint Cadet AT Centre would offer an excellent step forward for training - but the model shouldn’t be limited just to AT. All three services do Shooting, Radio Comms, Sports etc. I can’t help but think that a “common core” offer, with joint staff/cadet training centres specialising in each would make a slightly better way forward for all - and perhaps be the most cost effective way to use the money across all 3 services.
If, and only if, we can get away from the tribal thing.
Most recruitment excercises, as anyone with time in the cadet forces knows, whether aimed at cadets or adults are a flop. Just look at the massively expensive Army Reserve ads. The last 3 months has seen the recruitment of just 65 soldiers. (figures form Hansard, IIRC after a PMQ)
I would spend it on making sure every able* ACF detachment has a training program in place which includes real draws like shooting or night excercises.
I would then incentivise cadets to recruit their peers with small cash rewards. Any money left over I would incentivise CFAVs to recruit another for a cash reward too.
Because the 2 best recruiters are word of mouth, and a good training program (which means retention)
TA and Cadet units will tell you the same.
[quote=“Batfink” post=16589]
If, and only if, we can get away from the tribal thing.[/quote]
Bolleaux.
As someone who defected from one tribe to another, we must keep the tribal thing , but keep it professional and keep it focused on the cadets, who are not half as tribal as the adults. Frimley now trains ACF, CCF, ATC, SCC, and RMC to the same standard. They even have one bloke ATC as DS, and he is rather good (Helped me through a part of my SAAI course that I was having difficulty with, much to my surprise)
As long as we aren’t expected to subsume our identities and pride, we can all get along with those in the lesser cadet forces… 
Before throwing money at it, why are under scubcrised and or utlised often heard terms/phrases in relation to these places. We’ve tried to book Windermere or Llanbedr several times and got term time, akin to a chocolate fireguard.
Why limit ourselves to one or two centres? This is a military model that is OK for the military where people might get the time to attend, but does it, given the lack of use, fit our model, ie volunteers using holiday and or weekends, for infrequent courses and more likely than not travelling not inconsiderable distances, after a day at work and then back to go to work? Our LA offers courses in adventurous activities that give NGB qualifications, that doesn’t require travelling, are held a lot more frequently but the cost is prohibitive. So put some of the money into a pot for partial funding for CIs and allow entitled staff to claim pay to offset the cost of courses like this.
I think this will be a growing problem over the next few years.
Perhaps our higher echelons could use some of that money to lobby the government to permit time off school for organised youth group activities that have clearly demonstrable benefits.
[quote=“the silverback” post=16581]
£1,500,000/940Sqns= £1660 per Sqn.
Wing and regions do not need this gear as they only work 9-5 Mon Fri. It needs to go to the coal face. £1600 should be enough to get some or all of the following
Recruitment
1 X Marquee with sqn branding etc for events outdoor or large indoor areanas
2 X popups with activities contact details and parade times for said sqn.
ACO branded gissits for events as long as it is cheap and plentyful.
Decent quality recruitment literature with up to date local information. I recently found on my sqn some recruitment flyers that stated we had 7 regions. Info should be local to unit and not region and up to date. sqns in the past horded this stuff because there was not a plentyful supply.
Large banners to put out at events such to tell Joe public who we are and how to join. How many times have you been out in No 3 uniform or adv trg gear and people have no idea who we are what we do or how to join.
Recruitment paraphernalia needs to be bottom up and not top down as in the past. To me in South Wales having large expencive equipment such as the Climbing or ace platform Based in Cosford is no good to me especially if I have to go and fetch it.
For recrutment things need to be atractive and relevent to the local sqn, the flyers and gissits need to be plentyful with local information. They need to be kept up to date and the old stuff need to be binned. unles it has the current info on it it just look un professional.[/quote]
That’s okay if they get the phone number right on recruitment stuff. Who’s seen the latest adult recruiting banners?? Wrong number!!! So we get a patch to fix their mistake…
How much did the initial banner cost and how much was then spent to produce the fix…
I would rather spend the money on decent kit. My unit actually has better kit than most, but there are many units nearby still issuing cadets with 58 pattern webbing and old 58 ponchos that are no longer waterproof.